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[GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT [message #271617]

Tue, 10 February 2015 11:22

BobDunahugh

Messages: 2465
Registered: October 2010
Location: Cedar Rapids, IA

Karma: 11

Senior Member

I found this pretty interesting.

Bob Dunahugh

If you’re interested at all in engine building, this is definitely at the other end of the spectrum…
Check out Building GM’s Most Powerful Engine Ever, the 650hp http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=bLtZNtvc1Aw

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Re: [GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT [message #271632 is a reply to message #271617]

Tue, 10 February 2015 15:20

jhbridges

Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga

Karma: -74

Senior Member

It is interesting - I suppose we shouldn't call them 'Tonowanda Turds' any more when they're getting specific outputs over 100HP/Liter in a production engine. My luddite instincts rear up though when I see a cast crankshaft going into a blown engine, even when they limit boost to under 10PSI. I think I'd rather see a forged one - though I wonder what it would do for costs per engine...

--johnny

Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons. Braselton, Ga. I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell

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Re: [GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT [message #271640 is a reply to message #271632]

Tue, 10 February 2015 16:38

USAussie

Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia

Karma: 6

Senior Member

Johnny,

I was wondering about that as well, however, I wonder if that's correct.

Some additional comments:

No torque plate used when honing cylinders.

Engine spun at 2000 rpm for testing purposes

Serious computer monitored quality control measures in place; I can't see how one could duplicate those processes manually.

No wonder people install crate engines instead of having them rebuilt.

Regards,
Rob M.

-----Original Message-----
From: Johnny Bridges

It is interesting - I suppose we shouldn't call them 'Tonowanda Turds' any more when they're getting specific outputs over
100HP/Liter in a production engine. My luddite instincts rear up though when I see a cast crankshaft going into a blown engine,
even when they limit boost to under 10PSI. I think I'd rather see a forged one - though I wonder what it would do for costs per
engine...

--johnny

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Regards, Rob M. (USAussie) The Pedantic Mechanic Sydney, Australia '75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428 '75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426

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Re: [GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT [message #271646 is a reply to message #271617]

Tue, 10 February 2015 18:13

Matt Colie

Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan

Karma: 7

Senior Member

Time for Matt's comments..

It might be a cast crank, but I bet it is cast steel and not any normal steel either.
Forging only got you an advantage in strength when the alternative was a grey iron. GM has used cast steel cranks since the 4 bolt small block. (And that was a good engineering joke.) The 4 bolt block was bad, so smart people grabbed them up, took the crank out and tossed the rest.

Honing plates are a bandaid for a bad design. GM has been working very hard for years to make cylinder blocks that want to have round holes. Did you notice that the head bolt pattern is now a 4 bolt design (like Olds always used) and with Really Long fasteners? The short and long bolts of the 5 bolt SB were a lot of their bore distortion problem. The long fasteners also anchor in the block's cross web and not in the liner area and so there is probably very little fastener load induced bore distortion.

I was surprised that the two engines that they showed the rear of had clutches. Maybe there is hope still.

The reason there is so much automation doing the critical assembly and inspection is simple. Humans suck at that stuff. They get tired and bored and try to chat.

I am glad to see that after generations of bad design, they have finally done away with the adjacent exhaust ports.

Too bad it can't bolt to a 425 (without some Dave Lenzi work).

Matt

Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit

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Re: [GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT [message #271667 is a reply to message #271646]

Tue, 10 February 2015 22:38

Hal StClair

Messages: 971
Registered: March 2013
Location: Rio Rancho NM

Karma: -12

Senior Member

"I am glad to see that after generations of bad design, they have finally done away with the adjacent exhaust ports."

Not very new, 1997 LS1 had the same basic design and is the reason these motors have been making so much HP.
Hal

"I enjoy talking to you. Your mind appeals to me. It resembles my own mind, except you happen to be insane." 1977 Royale 101348, 1977 Royale 101586, Diesel powered, 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout, Rio Rancho, NM

[Updated on: Tue, 10 February 2015 22:38]

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Re: [GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT [message #271672 is a reply to message #271667]

Wed, 11 February 2015 04:40

USAussie

Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia

Karma: 6

Senior Member

Hal,

You're right nothing not very new I have a 1973 Caddy 500 with exhaust ports just like that! ;-)

Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426

-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Hal StClair
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2015 3:38 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] 650hp GM ENGINE PLANT

I am glad to see that after generations of bad design, they have finally done away with the adjacent exhaust ports.

Not very new, 1997 LS1 had the same basic design and is the reason these motors have been making so much HP.
Hal

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Regards, Rob M. (USAussie) The Pedantic Mechanic Sydney, Australia '75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428 '75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426

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