Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? (wheel bearings)
Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270704] |
Wed, 28 January 2015 23:37 |
Pryzl1
Messages: 100 Registered: November 2011 Location: Toledo, OH
Karma: 0
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Having had my coach for 3+ years and not knowing the condition of the bearings I need to have them inspected and insure they are good to go. That being said, I spoke with one of the GMC suppliers / service centers today. I asked if they inspected my wheel bearings and found they needed to be repaired or replaced would they add the zerk grease fittings. Their answer was a definitive NO. Their reasoning was that that there is a tendency for owners to over grease the bearings resulting in grease being thrown all over making a terrible mess.
What are the pros and cons of adding zeks to the wheel bearings? And does the group favor wheel bearings with or without the zerks?
Thanks for you thoughts and comments
John
1976 GMC Eleganza II - "The Never Ending Story"
Partial Restoration - a work in progress
455cc
NW Ohio
Member of the GMCMI, GMC Great Lakers Motorhome Club, GMCES and Dixielanders
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270709 is a reply to message #270704] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 00:50 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085 Registered: October 2008 Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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Pryzl1 wrote on Wed, 28 January 2015 21:37Having had my coach for 3+ years and not knowing the condition of the bearings I need to have them inspected and insure they are good to go. That being said, I spoke with one of the GMC suppliers / service centers today. I asked if they inspected my wheel bearings and found they needed to be repaired or replaced would they add the zerk grease fittings. Their answer was a definitive NO. Their reasoning was that that there is a tendency for owners to over grease the bearings resulting in grease being thrown all over making a terrible mess.
What are the pros and cons of adding zeks to the wheel bearings? And does the group favor wheel bearings with or without the zerks?
Thanks for you thoughts and comments
I have done my bearings twice with the puller and once more to put on the zerk fittings. I found the process difficult... It takes a lot of pressure to shove things apart and together. Apparently we didn't get it pressed enough of torque sufficiently because I lost a bearing... It was not making noise but was so loose it almost fell apart when removed. Ruined the hub.
I have greased it once with the zerks. Love it. You don't want to over do..you really are just pushing any crud that is working into the back of the bearing out as I understand it. Go until a little shoves out, wipe it down and tighten it back down.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270718 is a reply to message #270711] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 07:46 |
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The mechanic I used, who still has his own GMC and worked on them "in
the day" added the fitting for his coach and, as he told me, put in just
enough to do the job. He always said to squeeze lightly by hand and do
it slowly. When you see it starting to ooze quit.
Byron Songer
Kissimmee, FL
On 2015-01-29 03:02, gene Fisher wrote:
> Read here
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/front.html#ZERK
>
> Erf
>
> On Wednesday, January 28, 2015, John Pryzbylek
> wrote:
>
>> Having had my coach for 3+ years and not knowing the condition of the
>> bearings I need to have them inspected and insure they are good to go.
>> That
>> being said, I spoke with one of the GMC suppliers / service centers
>> today.
>> I asked if they inspected my wheel bearings and found they needed to
>> be
>> repaired or replaced would they add the zerk grease fittings. Their
>> answer was a definitive NO. Their reasoning was that that there is a
>> tendency
>> for owners to over grease the bearings resulting in grease being
>> thrown
>> all over making a terrible mess.
>> What are the pros and cons of adding zeks to the wheel bearings? And
>> does
>> the group favor wheel bearings with or without the zerks?
>>
>> Thanks for you thoughts and comments
>> --
>> John
>> 1976 GMC Eleganza II - "The Never Ending Story"
>> Partial Restoration - a work in progress
>> 455cc
>> NW Ohio
>> Member of the GMCMI, GMC Great Lakers Motor Home Club and Dixielanders
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270732 is a reply to message #270718] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 11:03 |
powwerjon
Messages: 849 Registered: March 2013
Karma: -2
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John,
The zerks on your hub & knuckle is the best mod for the front end. Dan Lenzi did a long term test on greasing the bearings unusually once a year. He has run the set on his coach 100K miles with out issues and they still look good. This is the short cut to the album. I have them on the stretch coach and on the Avion in the shop.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g4641-greasing-front-bearings-with-zerk-fittings.html
You best bet is to get a set of hubs from Dave and your cost will be about the same as having yours rebuilt if they are not worn in the inside. Dave also cuts grease release grooves in the bearings.
J.R. Wright
30' Buskirk Stretch
Michigan
On Location in Tucson
> On Jan 29, 2015, at 6:46 AM, bsonger@songerconsulting.net wrote:
>
> The mechanic I used, who still has his own GMC and worked on them "in the day" added the fitting for his coach and, as he told me, put in just enough to do the job. He always said to squeeze lightly by hand and do it slowly. When you see it starting to ooze quit.
>
> Byron Songer
> Kissimmee, FL
>
> On 2015-01-29 03:02, gene Fisher wrote:
>> Read here
>> http://gmcmotorhome.info/front.html#ZERK
>> Erf
>> On Wednesday, January 28, 2015, John Pryzbylek wrote:
>>> Having had my coach for 3+ years and not knowing the condition of the
>>> bearings I need to have them inspected and insure they are good to go. That
>>> being said, I spoke with one of the GMC suppliers / service centers today.
>>> I asked if they inspected my wheel bearings and found they needed to be
>>> repaired or replaced would they add the zerk grease fittings. Their
>>> answer was a definitive NO. Their reasoning was that that there is a
>>> tendency
>>> for owners to over grease the bearings resulting in grease being thrown
>>> all over making a terrible mess.
>>> What are the pros and cons of adding zeks to the wheel bearings? And does
>>> the group favor wheel bearings with or without the zerks?
>>> Thanks for you thoughts and comments
>>> --
>>> John
>>> 1976 GMC Eleganza II - "The Never Ending Story"
>>> Partial Restoration - a work in progress
>>> 455cc
>>> NW Ohio
>>> Member of the GMCMI, GMC Great Lakers Motor Home Club and Dixielanders
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270734 is a reply to message #270732] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 11:47 |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797 Registered: April 2011
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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The relief cuts in the bearing races are needed to allow grease to flow throughout the bearing. Don't bother with the grease fittings if you don't grind the passages in the races.
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
> On Jan 29, 2015, at 9:03 AM, John Wright wrote:
>
> John,
>
> The zerks on your hub & knuckle is the best mod for the front end. Dan Lenzi did a long term test on greasing the bearings unusually once a year. He has run the set on his coach 100K miles with out issues and they still look good. This is the short cut to the album. I have them on the stretch coach and on the Avion in the shop.
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g4641-greasing-front-bearings-with-zerk-fittings.html
>
> You best bet is to get a set of hubs from Dave and your cost will be about the same as having yours rebuilt if they are not worn in the inside. Dave also cuts grease release grooves in the bearings.
>
> J.R. Wright
> 30' Buskirk Stretch
> Michigan
> On Location in Tucson
>
>> On Jan 29, 2015, at 6:46 AM, bsonger@songerconsulting.net wrote:
>>
>> The mechanic I used, who still has his own GMC and worked on them "in the day" added the fitting for his coach and, as he told me, put in just enough to do the job. He always said to squeeze lightly by hand and do it slowly. When you see it starting to ooze quit.
>>
>> Byron Songer
>> Kissimmee, FL
>>
>>> On 2015-01-29 03:02, gene Fisher wrote:
>>> Read here
>>> http://gmcmotorhome.info/front.html#ZERK
>>> Erf
>>>> On Wednesday, January 28, 2015, John Pryzbylek wrote:
>>>> Having had my coach for 3+ years and not knowing the condition of the
>>>> bearings I need to have them inspected and insure they are good to go. That
>>>> being said, I spoke with one of the GMC suppliers / service centers today.
>>>> I asked if they inspected my wheel bearings and found they needed to be
>>>> repaired or replaced would they add the zerk grease fittings. Their
>>>> answer was a definitive NO. Their reasoning was that that there is a
>>>> tendency
>>>> for owners to over grease the bearings resulting in grease being thrown
>>>> all over making a terrible mess.
>>>> What are the pros and cons of adding zeks to the wheel bearings? And does
>>>> the group favor wheel bearings with or without the zerks?
>>>> Thanks for you thoughts and comments
>>>> --
>>>> John
>>>> 1976 GMC Eleganza II - "The Never Ending Story"
>>>> Partial Restoration - a work in progress
>>>> 455cc
>>>> NW Ohio
>>>> Member of the GMCMI, GMC Great Lakers Motor Home Club and Dixielanders
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> _______________________________________________
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270742 is a reply to message #270734] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 13:11 |
Terrance Boyd
Messages: 38 Registered: October 2008
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Are the grooves in the race or the spacer?
Terry
On Jan 29, 2015 9:47 AM, "Todd Sullivan" wrote:
> The relief cuts in the bearing races are needed to allow grease to flow
> throughout the bearing. Don't bother with the grease fittings if you don't
> grind the passages in the races.
>
> Todd Sullivan
>
> Sully
> 77 royale
> Seattle
>
>> On Jan 29, 2015, at 9:03 AM, John Wright wrote:
>>
>> John,
>>
>> The zerks on your hub & knuckle is the best mod for the front end. Dan
> Lenzi did a long term test on greasing the bearings unusually once a year.
> He has run the set on his coach 100K miles with out issues and they still
> look good. This is the short cut to the album. I have them on the stretch
> coach and on the Avion in the shop.
>>
>>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g4641-greasing-front-bearings-with-zerk-fittings.html
>>
>> You best bet is to get a set of hubs from Dave and your cost will be
> about the same as having yours rebuilt if they are not worn in the inside.
> Dave also cuts grease release grooves in the bearings.
>>
>> J.R. Wright
>> 30' Buskirk Stretch
>> Michigan
>> On Location in Tucson
>>
>>> On Jan 29, 2015, at 6:46 AM, bsonger@songerconsulting.net wrote:
>>>
>>> The mechanic I used, who still has his own GMC and worked on them "in
> the day" added the fitting for his coach and, as he told me, put in just
> enough to do the job. He always said to squeeze lightly by hand and do it
> slowly. When you see it starting to ooze quit.
>>>
>>> Byron Songer
>>> Kissimmee, FL
>>>
>>>> On 2015-01-29 03:02, gene Fisher wrote:
>>>> Read here
>>>> http://gmcmotorhome.info/front.html#ZERK
>>>> Erf
>>>> > On Wednesday, January 28, 2015, John Pryzbylek
> wrote:
>>>> > Having had my coach for 3+ years and not knowing the condition of the
>>>> > bearings I need to have them inspected and insure they are good to
> go. That
>>>> > being said, I spoke with one of the GMC suppliers / service centers
> today.
>>>> > I asked if they inspected my wheel bearings and found they needed to
> be
>>>> > repaired or replaced would they add the zerk grease fittings. Their
>>>> > answer was a definitive NO. Their reasoning was that that there is a
>>>> > tendency
>>>> > for owners to over grease the bearings resulting in grease being
> thrown
>>>> > all over making a terrible mess.
>>>> > What are the pros and cons of adding zeks to the wheel bearings? And
> does
>>>> > the group favor wheel bearings with or without the zerks?
>>>> > Thanks for you thoughts and comments
>>>> > --
>>>> > John
>>>> > 1976 GMC Eleganza II - "The Never Ending Story"
>>>> > Partial Restoration - a work in progress
>>>> > 455cc
>>>> > NW Ohio
>>>> > Member of the GMCMI, GMC Great Lakers Motor Home Club and Dixielanders
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > GMCnet mailing list
>>>> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>>> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270745 is a reply to message #270704] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 13:47 |
Larry
Messages: 2875 Registered: January 2004 Location: Menomonie, WI
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Groves are in the spacers NOT in the races or bearings. I'm surprised that a vendor would tell you that adding the zirk to the front knuckle would not be good. Even if you do overdue it with grease, the worse that extra grease can do is splatter on the undercarriage and knuckle...just adding to the anticorrosion. By installing zirks on the knuckles, along with groves or drilling holes in the spacer, you eliminate the need to take the knuckles part every 25K miles. Each time you take those knuckles apart, and press the races out then back in, you do more damage to the knuckle. The only inconvenient part of the operation is having to loosen the axle nut, remove the front wheel, and push the axle in before applying grease. If you don't do this, the hydraulic pressure of the grease going in will displace the inner seal. By pushing the axle in, it allows the excess grease to exit the knuckle between the minor diameter of the axle and the seal, therefore not displacing the seal. IMO, if you are going to take the knuckles/bearings apart, do it right once, and don't worry about it for the next 100K. JMHO
Larry
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
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Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270754 is a reply to message #270745] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 14:24 |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797 Registered: April 2011
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Yep spacer. My bad.
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
> On Jan 29, 2015, at 11:47 AM, Larry wrote:
>
> Groves are in the spacers NOT in the races or bearings. I'm surprised that a vendor would tell you that adding the zirk to the front knuckle would
> not be good. Even if you do overdue it with grease, the worse that extra grease can do is splatter on the undercarriage and knuckle...just adding to
> the anticorrosion. By installing zirks on the knuckles, along with groves or drilling holes in the spacer, you eliminate the need to take the
> knuckles part every 25K miles. Each time you take those knuckles apart, and press the races out then back in, you do more damage to the knuckle. The
> only inconvenient part of the operation is having to loosen the axle nut, remove the front wheel, and push the axle in before applying grease. If you
> don't do this, the hydraulic pressure of the grease going in will displace the inner seal. By pushing the axle in, it allows the excess grease to exit
> the knuckle between the minor diameter of the axle and the seal, therefore not displacing the seal. IMO, if you are going to take the
> knuckles/bearings apart, do it right once, and don't worry about it for the next 100K. JMHO
> --
> Larry
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
> _______________________________________________
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270765 is a reply to message #270745] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 17:33 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547 Registered: March 2007 Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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Larry wrote on Thu, 29 January 2015 14:47Groves are in the spacers NOT in the races or bearings. I'm surprised that a vendor would tell you that adding the zirk to the front knuckle would not be good. Even if you do overdue it with grease, the worse that extra grease can do is splatter on the undercarriage and knuckle...just adding to the anticorrosion. By installing zirks on the knuckles, along with groves or drilling holes in the spacer, you eliminate the need to take the knuckles part every 25K miles. Each time you take those knuckles apart, and press the races out then back in, you do more damage to the knuckle. The only inconvenient part of the operation is having to loosen the axle nut, remove the front wheel, and push the axle in before applying grease. If you don't do this, the hydraulic pressure of the grease going in will displace the inner seal. By pushing the axle in, it allows the excess grease to exit the knuckle between the minor diameter of the axle and the seal, therefore not displacing the seal. IMO, if you are going to take the knuckles/bearings apart, do it right once, and don't worry about it for the next 100K. JMHO
Larry,
By and large, I agree. Grease is always cheaper than parts.
Maybe the vendor that advised against has seen too many seals blown out with a grease gun.
The real purpose of the seal on a rolling bearing is not to keep the grease in, that is easy, but it is to keep the other stuff out.
I discovered as a result of an operator caused failure that most people don't know that a grease gun - your typical hand held grease gun - is usually good for 10,000 psi. There is no normal grease seal that can stand up to that.
I am hoping to zerks in my front hubs soon.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270790 is a reply to message #270765] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 20:20 |
Keith V
Messages: 2337 Registered: March 2008 Location: Mounds View,MN
Karma: 0
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How the heck do you over grease a bearing?
There is a potential to blow out the seal if you don't push the CV joint back, but thats not too much grease, just not enough following directions.
Also remember if you seperate the bearings you should replace them as you've probably ruined them
Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270791 is a reply to message #270765] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 20:22 |
Larry
Messages: 2875 Registered: January 2004 Location: Menomonie, WI
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Matt Colie wrote on Thu, 29 January 2015 17:33Larry wrote on Thu, 29 January 2015 14:47Groves are in the spacers NOT in the races or bearings. I'm surprised that a vendor would tell you that adding the zirk to the front knuckle would not be good. Even if you do overdue it with grease, the worse that extra grease can do is splatter on the undercarriage and knuckle...just adding to the anticorrosion. By installing zirks on the knuckles, along with groves or drilling holes in the spacer, you eliminate the need to take the knuckles part every 25K miles. Each time you take those knuckles apart, and press the races out then back in, you do more damage to the knuckle. The only inconvenient part of the operation is having to loosen the axle nut, remove the front wheel, and push the axle in before applying grease. If you don't do this, the hydraulic pressure of the grease going in will displace the inner seal. By pushing the axle in, it allows the excess grease to exit the knuckle between the minor diameter of the axle and the seal, therefore not displacing the seal. IMO, if you are going to take the knuckles/bearings apart, do it right once, and don't worry about it for the next 100K. JMHO
Larry,
By and large, I agree. Grease is always cheaper than parts.
Maybe the vendor that advised against has seen too many seals blown out with a grease gun.
The real purpose of the seal on a rolling bearing is not to keep the grease in, that is easy, but it is to keep the other stuff out.
I discovered as a result of an operator caused failure that most people don't know that a grease gun - your typical hand held grease gun - is usually good for 10,000 psi. There is no normal grease seal that can stand up to that.
I am hoping to zerks in my front hubs soon.
Matt
Matt,
Yup, in complete agreement.
Larry
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270794 is a reply to message #270704] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 21:04 |
Pryzl1
Messages: 100 Registered: November 2011 Location: Toledo, OH
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Thanks for the comments and links. I'm aware of Dave Lenzi's bearings and wanted to discuss the subject with him but I didn't want to bother him since he has other things on his plate that are significantly more important than my wheel bearings!
John
1976 GMC Eleganza II - "The Never Ending Story"
Partial Restoration - a work in progress
455cc
NW Ohio
Member of the GMCMI, GMC Great Lakers Motorhome Club, GMCES and Dixielanders
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Re: Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270802 is a reply to message #270794] |
Thu, 29 January 2015 22:13 |
Scott Nutter
Messages: 782 Registered: January 2015 Location: Houston/San Diego
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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If I don't upgrade to the 1 ton front end I will definitely go with the grease fittings. I couldn't imagine rebuilding the knuckles with out putting the fittings in. Could you put the zerk fittings in without pulling the hubs?
Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas
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Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Bearings - with or without zerks? [message #270849 is a reply to message #270790] |
Fri, 30 January 2015 20:19 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912 Registered: July 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Keith,
If you fill the bearings completely with grease and then pull the CV joint axle back into the hub quickly in theory you could force
the seal out.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/aa-miscellaneous-photos/p32480-knuckle-cross-section.html
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: Keith V
How the heck do you over grease a bearing?
There is a potential to blow out the seal if you don't push the CV joint back, but thats not too much grease, just not enough
following directions.
Also remember if you seperate the bearings you should replace them as you've probably ruined them
--
Keith
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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