| Tracker AC problems [message #262839] |
Fri, 26 September 2014 12:11  |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
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We have been going round and round with Tom Phipps Tracker AC. We replaced the bad compressor and at the same time flushed the evaporator and condenser and replaced the dryer. We pulled a good vacuum on it without leaks and started charging it up.
One can of Duracool (spec. called for 1.3# of 134) gave us a low of 20# and a hi of 95# but little to no cooling. This week I tried to add more but it appeared to not take any more. when I opened the low valve the low press. went to 95 and nothing really changed. I closed the low valve and the pressure stayed at 20#.
I'm kind of at loss here. Usually this works and when it doesn't I don't know what to do.
Any ideas????
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262843 is a reply to message #262841] |
Fri, 26 September 2014 14:01  |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Did you also replace the oil in the system? Unless you have a totally clean system I would not mix the wax free mineral oil with the PAG oil that was used with the R-134 as you can have a gummy mess inside. If you are planning to use Duracool in the future and have completely flushed and drained and flushed the compressor then the wax free mineral oil is a good choice.
JR Wright
78 Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion
Michigan
On Sep 26, 2014, at 2:23 PM, Richard MacDonald wrote:
> Wow, as the former owner of that Tracker I am surprised. Before the
> Compressor failed, I had great cooling.
> Only thing I can think of is, if the Compressor failure caused a
> obstruction in the expansion valve, that would limit the cooling.
> Did you flush the entire system? Also, did you do a reverse flush?
> Sorry that Tom is having these problems.
>
> Richard
>
>
> On 9/26/2014 1:11 PM, fred veenschoten wrote:
>> We have been going round and round with Tom Phipps Tracker AC. We replaced the bad compressor and at the same time flushed the evaporator and
>> condenser and replaced the dryer. We pulled a good vacuum on it without leaks and started charging it up.
>>
>> One can of Duracool (spec. called for 1.3# of 134) gave us a low of 20# and a hi of 95# but little to no cooling. This week I tried to add more but it
>> appeared to not take any more. when I opened the low valve the low press. went to 95 and nothing really changed. I closed the low valve and the
>> pressure stayed at 20#.
>>
>> I'm kind of at loss here. Usually this works and when it doesn't I don't know what to do.
>>
>> Any ideas????
>>
>
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #262849 is a reply to message #262839] |
Fri, 26 September 2014 15:14 |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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If the suction line is cold and sweaty you may have a heat damper not fully closed?
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262854 is a reply to message #262850] |
Fri, 26 September 2014 16:51 |
Richard MacDonald
Messages: 47
Registered: July 2010
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On 9/26/2014 4:32 PM, A. wrote:
> Richard MacDonald wrote on Fri, 26 September 2014 13:23
>> Wow, as the former owner of that Tracker I am surprised. Before the Compressor failed, I had great cooling.
>> Only thing I can think of is, if the Compressor failure caused a obstruction in the expansion valve, that would limit the cooling.
>> Did you flush the entire system? Also, did you do a reverse flush?
>> Sorry that Tom is having these problems.
>>
>> Richard
> What would the high side pressure be if the expansion valve is plugged?
I would think about equal to the low side,
I may be wrong on that however it won't cool if the expansion valve is
restricted, I was told to flush forward and reverse.
Richard
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262874 is a reply to message #262854] |
Fri, 26 September 2014 21:41 |
Bullitthead
Messages: 1411
Registered: November 2013
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If the expansion valve or other style of flow restriction is plugged, the high side will go higher and the low side will go way low, maybe to vacuum.
Terry Kelpien
ASE Master Technician
73 Glacier 260
Smithfield, Va.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262876 is a reply to message #262874] |
Fri, 26 September 2014 21:48 |
Bullitthead
Messages: 1411
Registered: November 2013
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If there is any cooling happening at all in the Tracker, slowly add some more refrigerant until the low side increases over the charge pressure, which should probably be about 25 psi. Stop adding as soon as the pressure goes over 25 and check for a cool return line during the whole process. It sounds like your system is working, but all the cool is used up before the evaporator is cold, so you need more refrigerant to fill the evaporator.
Terry Kelpien
ASE Master Technician
73 Glacier 260
Smithfield, Va.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262886 is a reply to message #262876] |
Sat, 27 September 2014 07:46 |
tphipps
Messages: 3005
Registered: August 2004
Location: Spanish Fort, AL
Karma: 9
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To add,
We replaced the A/C compressor, dryer and expansion valve with new from Rockauto. All lines were flushed. Condenser was flushed. Center outlet was at 70 degrees, now it is at 80 degrees. There are no leaks.
The expansion valve is a bitch to remove and install. I think they installed the A/C before installing the rest of the dash.
Tom, MS II
2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552
KA4CSG
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262970 is a reply to message #262876] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 08:31 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
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Bullitthead wrote on Fri, 26 September 2014 21:48If there is any cooling happening at all in the Tracker, slowly add some more refrigerant until the low side increases over the charge pressure, which should probably be about 25 psi. Stop adding as soon as the pressure goes over 25 and check for a cool return line during the whole process. It sounds like your system is working, but all the cool is used up before the evaporator is cold, so you need more refrigerant to fill the evaporator.
I am not able to get it to take any more juice. As in my first post when I open the low valve to add juice the low press. goes to 95#; close the valve and it pumps down to 20#. Hi side stays at 95#. So it looks like when I try to add juice the hi and low side equalize and nothing gets added. The suction line is just a bit cooler feeling than ambient.
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262975 is a reply to message #262970] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 09:36 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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Fred
Are you sure that you are using the gauge set correctly? If you open the low side and it goes to 95 psi it sounds as if you have the valve on the high side of the gauge set open so that the high pressure can go to the low side. That is the only explanation that I can think of.
Be sure that the high side is turned all the way closed and try again. In fact just detach the high side hose. It is not needed when you fill and unless you suspect a bad compressor don't even bother to attach the high side.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick, CO
On Sep 29, 2014, at 8:31 AM, fred veenschoten wrote:
> Bullitthead wrote on Fri, 26 September 2014 21:48
>> If there is any cooling happening at all in the Tracker, slowly add some more refrigerant until the low side increases over the charge pressure,
>> which should probably be about 25 psi. Stop adding as soon as the pressure goes over 25 and check for a cool return line during the whole process.
>> It sounds like your system is working, but all the cool is used up before the evaporator is cold, so you need more refrigerant to fill the
>> evaporator.
>
> I am not able to get it to take any more juice. As in my first post when I open the low valve to add juice the low press. goes to 95#; close the valve
> and it pumps down to 20#. Hi side stays at 95#. So it looks like when I try to add juice the hi and low side equalize and nothing gets added. The
> suction line is just a bit cooler feeling than ambient.
>
> --
> Fred V
> '77 Royale RB 455
> P'cola, Fl
> _______________________________________________
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> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #262988 is a reply to message #262970] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 13:14 |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Try what Emery has suggested it does sound like it is low on refrigerant. Are you sure the schrader valve is depressing all the way when the hose is installed ? If the low side is at 20 lbs and the can is at 95 the coolent can only go into the compressor till the pressure is the same in the can or compressor unless the schrader valve isn't opening to allow it to equalize.
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #262993 is a reply to message #262839] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 14:44 |
C Boyd
Messages: 2629
Registered: April 2006
Karma: 18
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Senior Member |
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Hi Fred: sometimes I have to put the can of Freon in a bucket of hot water while hooked up to get it to transfer. Shaking the can helps sometimes. On our tracker bout 3 cans does it good.
fred v wrote on Fri, 26 September 2014 13:11We have been going round and round with Tom Phipps Tracker AC. We replaced the bad compressor and at the same time flushed the evaporator and condenser and replaced the dryer. We pulled a good vacuum on it without leaks and started charging it up.
One can of Duracool (spec. called for 1.3# of 134) gave us a low of 20# and a hi of 95# but little to no cooling. This week I tried to add more but it appeared to not take any more. when I opened the low valve the low press. went to 95 and nothing really changed. I closed the low valve and the pressure stayed at 20#.
I'm kind of at loss here. Usually this works and when it doesn't I don't know what to do.
Any ideas????
C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #262997 is a reply to message #262994] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 15:42 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
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OBTW:
What year Tracker? The earliest ones have R12 systems.
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
[Updated on: Mon, 29 September 2014 15:43] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #263003 is a reply to message #262997] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 17:13 |
tphipps
Messages: 3005
Registered: August 2004
Location: Spanish Fort, AL
Karma: 9
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1976 Tracker = R134a. Did nothing with the oil in the new A/C compressor. I don't remember how much was in the compressor as delivered. Might be a clue. Opps! 1996 Tracker. Dumb iPad keyboard.
Tom, MS II
2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552
KA4CSG
[Updated on: Mon, 29 September 2014 19:56] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #263012 is a reply to message #263003] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 18:45 |
Bullitthead
Messages: 1411
Registered: November 2013
Karma: 5
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Hope you meant 1996, not 1976. I'm with Emery on the charging manifold not working/adjusted properly. Some have a sliding valve inside that protects the low side from getting access to the high pressure, and sometimes the mixture of oils and different refrigerants can make a sticky substance that kinda "cures" after the refrigerants leave the scene so valves like that can get stuck. If that valve has become stuck to allow access to the high side, then you will be denied access to the low side until the valve is freed.
Terry Kelpien
ASE Master Technician
73 Glacier 260
Smithfield, Va.
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #263017 is a reply to message #262839] |
Mon, 29 September 2014 19:28 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Try another gauge set if available. If this is a piercing type can tap the over tightness can pinch the gasket at the can tap and prevent flow. Also if that fasket is bad or lost you can cut a new one from vacuum hose.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Tracker AC problems [message #263072 is a reply to message #262975] |
Tue, 30 September 2014 13:12 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
Karma: 0
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Emory, you may have it. The hi hose was connected and may have had it's valve open. That sure would explain a lot.
We will try again and see what happens.
emerystora wrote on Mon, 29 September 2014 09:36Fred
Are you sure that you are using the gauge set correctly? If you open the low side and it goes to 95 psi it sounds as if you have the valve on the high side of the gauge set open so that the high pressure can go to the low side. That is the only explanation that I can think of.
Be sure that the high side is turned all the way closed and try again. In fact just detach the high side hose. It is not needed when you fill and unless you suspect a bad compressor don't even bother to attach the high side.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick, CO
On Sep 29, 2014, at 8:31 AM, fred veenschoten wrote:
> Bullitthead wrote on Fri, 26 September 2014 21:48
>> If there is any cooling happening at all in the Tracker, slowly add some more refrigerant until the low side increases over the charge pressure,
>> which should probably be about 25 psi. Stop adding as soon as the pressure goes over 25 and check for a cool return line during the whole process.
>> It sounds like your system is working, but all the cool is used up before the evaporator is cold, so you need more refrigerant to fill the
>> evaporator.
>
> I am not able to get it to take any more juice. As in my first post when I open the low valve to add juice the low press. goes to 95#; close the valve
> and it pumps down to 20#. Hi side stays at 95#. So it looks like when I try to add juice the hi and low side equalize and nothing gets added. The
> suction line is just a bit cooler feeling than ambient.
>
> --
> Fred V
> '77 Royale RB 455
> P'cola, Fl
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: Tracker AC problems [message #263490 is a reply to message #262839] |
Sun, 05 October 2014 17:36 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Tom came over Sat. and we hooked up the gauges again without the hi press. valve open and we were able to add more Duracool. The lo press. line got noticeably cooler so I think we have the problem solved (my ignorance). Learn something every day.
The next problem that we haven't mentioned is that the new comp. was very difficult to turn by hand and after running it the oil is a dark grey from alum. in the oil. I suspect the new comp. will destroy itself soon and we will get to do this all over again. Love that Chinese junk.
fred v wrote on Fri, 26 September 2014 12:11We have been going round and round with Tom Phipps Tracker AC. We replaced the bad compressor and at the same time flushed the evaporator and condenser and replaced the dryer. We pulled a good vacuum on it without leaks and started charging it up.
One can of Duracool (spec. called for 1.3# of 134) gave us a low of 20# and a hi of 95# but little to no cooling. This week I tried to add more but it appeared to not take any more. when I opened the low valve the low press. went to 95 and nothing really changed. I closed the low valve and the pressure stayed at 20#.
I'm kind of at loss here. Usually this works and when it doesn't I don't know what to do.
Any ideas????
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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