| Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230614] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 04:09  |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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Someone put one in to a 6000 foot strip in Kansas yesterday. I wonder how light they can make that plane. Maybe they will add jet assist. I once met a United pilot that put a DC-10 into Washington National. They were able to lighten it up enough (no baggage, fuel, or people) to get it out of there and over to Dulles.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230617 is a reply to message #230614] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 05:34  |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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| Ken Burton wrote on Thu, 21 November 2013 04:09 |
Someone put one in to a 6000 foot strip in Kansas yesterday. I wonder how light they can make that plane. Maybe they will add jet assist. I once met a United pilot that put a DC-10 into Washington National. They were able to lighten it up enough (no baggage, fuel, or people) to get it out of there and over to Dulles.
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I just looked up the KAAO airport and it is only 6100 feet by 100 wide. What is worse it the runway is only rated for 62,000 pounds. By comparison ours is rated at 375,000. I looked up Ohare and most of their runways are rated at 350,000 but they have one rated at 902,000 for heavy aircraft.
Maybe they will empty 747 and fill it with bags of helium.
The news reports say that after landing they called the tower and asked for taxi instructions still not knowing where they were.
I have done the same thing twice (not in a 747). In both cases it was at night and I transitioned from instrument to visual approach. Once you see the runway lights I normally do not look back at the ILS. In both of my cases the approach (or tower) controller asked my where I was going and got me back where I belonged on course before I landed at the wrong airport. After landing at the correct airport, I talked to one controller handling me. His response was "You aren't the first one". I guess this happens quite often especially at night.
This is going to be interesting to watch.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230625 is a reply to message #230623] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 07:33 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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| Larry wrote on Thu, 21 November 2013 07:18 |
You may want to talk to Howard Glenna...a retired NW 747 pilot that now belongs to the Greater Midwest Classics. If you want to talk to him, let me know by PM and I will give you his email and phone #.
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Thanks Larry,
I just put this up for a human interest story.
It appears that an empty 747 is around 400,000 pounds. A fully loaded one is 800,000 to 910,000 depending on model. They got it turned around with a tug this morning and now claim it will be out of there in 5 hours. So it must be within the capability of the aircraft to get out of there in 6100 feet. Cold weather will help as it takes less runway when cold. I still wonder about the strength of the runway.
This may turn in to an old story by the end of the day.
Thanks
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230626 is a reply to message #230614] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 07:38 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Well, the pilot is now famous. This story made the TODAY show. It's not just a 747, it's a 747 Dreamlifter, one of the big pregnant guppie looking things. They meant to land at McConnell AFB six miles away.
The recorded exchanges are hilarious.
Tower: "Giant 4747 Heavy, Do you know what airport you are at?"
Pilot: "Well, we think we have a pretty good pulse. Let me ask you this. How many airports do you have directly south of your 1-9 are there?"
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230640 is a reply to message #230617] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 08:55 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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I expect the 100 wide and 62,000 pounds make for way moreworry than the length. After all, it's Kansas. It's reasonably flat our there
From: Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 6:34 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet?
Ken Burton wrote on Thu, 21 November 2013 04:09
> Someone put one in to a 6000 foot strip in Kansas yesterday. I wonder how light they can make that plane. Maybe they will add jet assist. I once met a United pilot that put a DC-10 into Washington National. They were able to lighten it up enough (no baggage, fuel, or people) to get it out of there and over to Dulles.
I just looked up the KAAO airport and it is only 6100 feet by 100 wide. What is worse it the runway is only rated for 62,000 pounds. By comparison ours is rated at 375,000. I looked up Ohare and most of their runways are rated at 350,000 but they have one rated at 902,000 for heavy aircraft.
Maybe they will empty 747 and fill it with bags of helium.
The news reports say that after landing they called the tower and asked for taxi instructions still not knowing where they were.
I have done the same thing twice (not in a 747). In both cases it was at night and I transitioned from instrument to visual approach. Once you see the runway lights I normally do not look back at the ILS. In both of my cases the approach (or tower) controller asked my where I was going and got me back where I belonged on course before I landed at the wrong airport. After landing at the correct airport, I talked to one controller handling me. His response was "You aren't the first one". I guess this happens quite often especially at night.
This is going to be interesting to watch.
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230645 is a reply to message #230640] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 09:28 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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There is a flight plan filed in the system right now for a 12:10 CST departure for Atlas 4241. It shows an 8 minute flight to McConnel AFB. It is KAAO to KIAB. I've neve seen an 8 monute flight plan before.
The previous flight yesterday started at LIBG in Italy with a stop at KJFK. 3 hours later it shows KJFK to KIAB landing at 9:20PM CST yesterday. Also interesting is that there is a ? mark after the landing time and when you click on the ? mark it says "result unknown".
It looks like they think they are going to get it out of there today if the concrete holds up.
Maybe Boeing will by KAAO a new runway when this is all done.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230662 is a reply to message #230640] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 10:57 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
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By takeoff time, the wind ought to be really howling out of the north and that will help! The low temperature also ought to help!
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~~ k2gkk @ hotmail dot com ~~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ex-Palm Beach, 76 ~ ~ ~
~~ k2gkk + hotmail dot com ~~
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> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2013 06:55:03 -0800
> From: jhbridges@ymail.com
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet?
>
> I expect the 100 wide and 62,000 pounds make for way moreworry than the length. After all, it's Kansas. It's reasonably flat our there
>
>
> From: Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net>
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 6:34 AM
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet?
>
>
>
>
> Ken Burton wrote on Thu, 21 November 2013 04:09
> > Someone put one in to a 6000 foot strip in Kansas yesterday. I wonder how light they can make that plane. Maybe they will add jet assist. I once met a United pilot that put a DC-10 into Washington National. They were able to lighten it up enough (no baggage, fuel, or people) to get it out of there and over to Dulles.
>
>
> I just looked up the KAAO airport and it is only 6100 feet by 100 wide. What is worse it the runway is only rated for 62,000 pounds. By comparison ours is rated at 375,000. I looked up Ohare and most of their runways are rated at 350,000 but they have one rated at 902,000 for heavy aircraft.
>
> Maybe they will empty 747 and fill it with bags of helium.
>
> The news reports say that after landing they called the tower and asked for taxi instructions still not knowing where they were.
>
> I have done the same thing twice (not in a 747). In both cases it was at night and I transitioned from instrument to visual approach. Once you see the runway lights I normally do not look back at the ILS. In both of my cases the approach (or tower) controller asked my where I was going and got me back where I belonged on course before I landed at the wrong airport. After landing at the correct airport, I talked to one controller handling me. His response was "You aren't the first one". I guess this happens quite often especially at night.
>
> This is going to be interesting to watch.
>
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230684 is a reply to message #230661] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 13:29 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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Thanks Wally, Listening to that was very funny.
"There is a guy walking up to the plane."
They were implying that they were going to ask where they were.
"How many airports south of McConnell?
"You are north of McConnell."
Once they screwed up and landed they had no idea where they were.
They had a flight plan to leave at 12:10 CST today for McConnell. That did not happen. So I'm watching to see what they do next.
Weather at 12:30 CST was 600 overcast and 10 miles with a 23 knot north wind gusting to 31. Temp was 34. All of that sounded like a good situation if they went off north bound. It is suppose to change to freezing drizzle later in the day. They need to get out of there before then. I'm sure they do not have deicing equipment large enough for an over size 747-400 where they are at.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230689 is a reply to message #230688] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 14:03 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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I thought of Colonel Ken and maybe he could tow or push it out of there. It turns out they did OK on their own. I'm pretty sure they went out with minimum fuel. I do not know about the cargo. It may have still been on board.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230729 is a reply to message #230614] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 08:53 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Empty and minimum fuel, 6K feet ought to be fairly easy. No pax, no requirement to compute accellerate-stop.... which is likely more than 6K.
--johnny
From: Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 5:09 AM
Subject: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet?
Someone put one in to a 6000 foot strip in Kansas yesterday. I wonder how light they can make that plane. Maybe they will add jet assist. I once met a United pilot that put a DC-10 into Washington National. They were able to lighten it up enough (no baggage, fuel, or people) to get it out of there and over to Dulles.
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet? [message #230730 is a reply to message #230729] |
Fri, 22 November 2013 00:20 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
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According to the press reports the plane had a 787 fuselage onboard. The weather and temp and the low fuel load it got off and did the 8 minute flight to the other airport.
<http://www.kwch.com/news/local-news/boeing-dreamlifter-lands-at-jabara/-/21054266/23081256/-/oma90hz/-/index.html>
or
http://goo.gl/oZwae8
JR Wright
78 Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion
Michigan
On Nov 21, 2013, at 9:53 AM, Johnny Bridges <jhbridges@ymail.com> wrote:
> Empty and minimum fuel, 6K feet ought to be fairly easy. No pax, no requirement to compute accellerate-stop.... which is likely more than 6K.
>
> --johnny
>
>
> From: Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net>
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2013 5:09 AM
> Subject: [GMCnet] Can a 747 take off in 6000 feet?
>
>
>
>
> Someone put one in to a 6000 foot strip in Kansas yesterday. I wonder how light they can make that plane. Maybe they will add jet assist. I once met a United pilot that put a DC-10 into Washington National. They were able to lighten it up enough (no baggage, fuel, or people) to get it out of there and over to Dulles.
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
> _______________________________________________
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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