Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do???
| To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198719] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 10:05  |
mojoe
Messages: 319
Registered: November 2012
Location: Monroe, NC
Karma: 0
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As some know because of all my questions on how to do or where to buy, I am restoring a 1975 Eleganza ll.
I sat down Saturday while it was snowing and put pen to paper to add up all the things I thought where great ideas that I have read about on here to do to my coach while I was restoring it.
Guess what... Wants really outweigh the money. And if I waited to do the things when money was there I would never be able to use my coach.
I added up what I thought it would take to finish up the inside and that was still in budget
But the mech upgrades where killing me.
So here is my short list of things to do so at least I can get Odie on the road and meet some of you guys.
1) Rebuilt carb.
2) Rebuilt starter.
3) Replaced Plugs
4) Changed oil.
5) Changed air filter.
6) Change plug wires.
7) Change fan belts
 Change water pump
9) Replace master cyld and booster
10)Flush brake lines
11)Replace rubber brake lnes
12)Replace wheel cylds.
13)Brake shoes and pads (Are new on the coach from po)
14)Replace Front wheel bearings.
15)Remove fuel tanks and clean.
16)Replace fuel gauge and all fuel rubber lines.
17)Install wireless air compressor and lines
18)Replace worn air bag.
Again this is a short list. But looking to play with the big dogs and still be able to eat.
Any thoughts on this would be great. But remember guys.. Economy is killing me and money is short.
Just want a safe coach for now and be able to upgrade later on in life.
Thanks in advance Joe
Joe Kemenczky..
1975 Eleganza ll " Odie " 75,000 miles..
"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain.
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[Updated on: Sun, 17 February 2013 14:33] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198722 is a reply to message #198719] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 11:08  |
bwevers
Messages: 597
Registered: October 2010
Location: San Jose
Karma: 5
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My 1975 Glenbrook was a $5000 rig when I bought it from a guy in Nashville.
The tires had to be replaced before I could drive it.
After I drove it, the front wheel bearings froze. This
is very expensive to repair.
Then my brakes didn't work very well, brake booster was bad.
And that was before I discovered the leaking airbags.
8 years later and $10K+ invested, I can now drive it anywhere.
Hopefully your suspension is in good shape. That
will save you $$.
I would definitely check the wheel bearings first.
Good Luck,
Bill
Bill Wevers GMC49ers, GMC Western States
1975 Glenbrook - Manny Powerdrive, OneTon
455 F Block, G heads
San Jose
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| Re: To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198723 is a reply to message #198719] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 11:26 |
mojoe
Messages: 319
Registered: November 2012
Location: Monroe, NC
Karma: 0
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Yea Bill everyone says "if you haven't changed your front wheel bearings they haven't been changed!" Hopefully thats on my winter to do list.
Joe Kemenczky..
1975 Eleganza ll " Odie " 75,000 miles..
"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain.
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198728 is a reply to message #198727] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 11:43 |
mojoe
Messages: 319
Registered: November 2012
Location: Monroe, NC
Karma: 0
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Gene I knew that list was on the net someplace.. I remember seeing it before I bought my coach and was dreaming about owning one. thanks for finding it for me I will add it to my favorites so I want loose it again.
joe
Joe Kemenczky..
1975 Eleganza ll " Odie " 75,000 miles..
"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain.
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198730 is a reply to message #198723] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 11:44 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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I'm holding the receipt where Sirum charged the PO to do the front end. I trust it. But they're coming due again..... sgh.
johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
From: Joe Kemenczky <toyomojoe@live.com>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2013 12:26 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do???
Yea Bill everyone says "if you haven't changed your front wheel bearings they haven't been changed!" Hopefully thats on my winter to do list.
--
Joe Kemenczky
1975 Eleganza ll (Odie) 75,000 miles.
Working on complete restoration. In year 2 of a 3 year restoration.
Loving every minute!
Monroe, NC (East of Charlotte).
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198732 is a reply to message #198731] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 11:55 |
mojoe
Messages: 319
Registered: November 2012
Location: Monroe, NC
Karma: 0
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I have a receipt for work that was done on my coach before it was left to sit by rv dealer. has new upper and lower ball joints, new CV joints , new shocks (which have some rust on them now)4 new tires (which are cracked now).
I am hoping for the best on the front end. we will see.
Joe Kemenczky..
1975 Eleganza ll " Odie " 75,000 miles..
"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain.
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[Updated on: Sun, 17 February 2013 11:56] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198794 is a reply to message #198719] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 21:16 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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| toyomojoe wrote on Sun, 17 February 2013 11:05 |
As some know because of all my questions on how to do or where to buy, I am restoring a 1975 Eleganza ll.
I sat down Saturday while it was snowing and put pen to paper to add up all the things I thought where great ideas that I have read about on here to do to my coach while I was restoring it.
Guess what... Wants really outweigh the money. And if I waited to do the things when money was there I would never be able to use my coach.
I added up what I thought it would take to finish up the inside and that was still in budget
But the mech upgrades where killing me.
So here is my short list of things to do so at least I can get Odie on the road and meet some of you guys.
<snip - Joe's list is below>
Again this is a short list. But looking to play with the big dogs and still be able to eat.
Any thoughts on this would be great. But remember guys.. Economy is killing me and money is short.
Just want a safe coach for now and be able to upgrade later on in life.
Thanks in advance Joe
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Joe,
Don't feel like some lone ranger. The administration's abrogation of the bankruptcy laws cost me about twenty years of scrimping and saving for my retirement. Well - Easy Come - Easy Go (All I have to do is A - Find another job (for a 60+yo white male engineer?) and then work until I'm 85 with no time off at all and I could be in good shape.)
Here is your list with revisions based on my experience.
1) Rebuilt carb. -- Is it giving you trouble?
2) Rebuilt starter. -- Just take it apart and put in 4$ of new brushes. That 10MT starter is a brute.
3) Replaced Plugs -- No history - Is it HEI? just hammer them back to 0.035
4) Changed oil. -- Always a good thing
5) Changed air filter. -- Look at it, shake it off, Is it oiled? Maybe
6) Change plug wires. -- Open the engine room at night. Is there a light show? Mist water - still no show? leave them alone
7) Change fan belts -- Possibly good if you can get the correct belts - I have real problems there.
8.) Change water pump -- Any particular reason??
9) Replace master cyld and booster -- Ditto
10)Flush brake lines -- Oh you bet and sooner is better
11)Replace rubber brake lines -- real PITA job, but if you see cracks.... Now would be good.
12)Replace wheel cylds. -- Again - Why?
13)Brake shoes and pads (Are new on the coach from po) -- Great
14)Replace Front wheel bearings. -- Requires special tools. Either decide to go the 1ton route or call Dave Linze.
15)Remove fuel tanks and clean. -- Possibly worth doing. It is a PITA job without a pit or a hoist, but looking inside is not a bad thing to do.
16)Replace fuel gauge and all fuel rubber lines. -- Replace all the rubber - yes. But sending units are 150ea. Unfortunately, it only takes a little corrosion (now real possible with carpoline) to make that happen. I may have repaired mine, but I will not write about it until the end of a successful season.
17)Install wireless air compressor and lines -- If you are cash short, this may not be the best idea. They can be repaired. I haven't looked a prices because mine works just fine.
18)Replace worn air bag. -- Good idea if you can find used/cheap or go to Sullybag.
As said, this is all based on my recent experience. All steel fuel system was last year, repaired gauges and new brake hoses this year.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198807 is a reply to message #198794] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 21:58 |
mojoe
Messages: 319
Registered: November 2012
Location: Monroe, NC
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Thanks Matt for your input.
I think I will start with what I know and work on down the list.
Carb was gummed and now rebuilt and replaced. Got Odie running, ran for about 10 mins or so till I relized the power steering pump was dry. After that starter was shot.Starter is in the back of my truck rebuilt and ready to put back on. So I'll do that start it up and let it run awhile.If it seems ok Ill move on to the brakes. Thinking of rebuilding the complete system. all gummed up.. Its always good to be able to stop.lol After that maybe the front bearings..Local GMCer here says he has a tool and would give me a hand. Hopefully by that time it will be warmer and I can move back to the inside where I know what I am doing..
Maybe one of the postions I applied for will come open.. so Ill have some money to move on to other things.
Good luck. Joe
Joe Kemenczky..
1975 Eleganza ll " Odie " 75,000 miles..
"When I was younger, I could remember anything, whether it had happened or not." - Mark Twain.
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198812 is a reply to message #198809] |
Sun, 17 February 2013 22:34 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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A,
Please be advised that IIRC when the guy that invented / designed the bearing greasing tool (Chuck Aulgur) made a presentation on
how to use it he noted that is was probably not a good idea to use it without disassembling the bearings and inspecting their
condition, the condition of the hubs and knuckles.
Regards,
Rob M.
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: A.
On front bearings. I guess GM expected them to last 100K miles or more when the motorhome was originally designed. There is no
mention of front wheel bearing maintenance in the '73 mainenance schedule.
The "old" way of doing it (dismantling the press-fit parts) probably does more harm than good.
Buy the bearing greaser tool (http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/885 ) and follow the directions, or send them off to someone
and have them rebuilt and grease zerks installed so they don't have to be dismantled to be greased.
FYI, the procedure for greasing them when they have zerks installed is basically the same as using the greaser. You still have to
loosen the wheel nut and move the axle inward to keep from blowing out the seal (see instructions at
http://appliedgmc.com/images/greaser3.pdf ).
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198861 is a reply to message #198730] |
Mon, 18 February 2013 09:33 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Johnny,
Call me a Luddite, or whatever, but I just can't get into that "25,000 mile
thing". Stop & think about it: The bearings should have slight
interference fit in the knuckle when assembled. That's not difficult to
achieve during the first assembly, but during the second and subsequent???
From what I've seen & heard, egg-shaping of the knuckle is a far more
common failure mode than bearing failure, whether from grease deterioration
or contamination.
The ideal is to have had Zerk fittings installed during a careful "initial"
bearing assembly so the grease can periodically be flushed. Without that,
I'm in favor of periodic looseness checks (rock the wheel top-bottom to
check for play), and don't tamper with the bearings unless the play's
significant -- in which case, you need more than re-packed bearings. Of
course, there are other, less common failure indications, such as noise,
grease loss, or overheating, that must be watched for. But absent those,
why tamper with something that's working good?
What I would NOT do is risk polluting the grease and bearings with
abrasives, from the inevitably dirty undercarriage, by injecting grease
from the axle side of the hub.
JMHO about a fight in which I happily don't have a dog, since I installed
the 1-Ton front end. :-)
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI+ & EBL
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Sun, Feb 17, 2013 at 12:44 PM, Johnny Bridges wrote:
> I'm holding the receipt where Sirum charged the PO to do the front end.
> I trust it. But they're coming due again..... sgh.
>
> From: Joe Kemenczky
> Yea Bill everyone says "if you haven't changed your front wheel bearings
> they haven't been changed!" Hopefully thats on my winter to do list.
> --
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198917 is a reply to message #198861] |
Mon, 18 February 2013 17:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Ken,
To expand on your email below from one of Dave Lenzi's presentations I remember he noted that the bore in the knuckle is cut with a
pointed lathe tool. That results in a surface that is like saw teeth with peaks and valleys which has the effect of reducing the
surface area that supports the bearings. The bearings beat into the top surface of the knuckle ID creating the egg shape you note
below.
He plasma sprays the bearing ID in the knuckle then grinds it to the correct dimension. The ground ID does not have saw teeth it is
flat.
Regards,
Rob M.
Sydney, Australia
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Henderson
Johnny,
Call me a Luddite, or whatever, but I just can't get into that "25,000 mile
thing". Stop & think about it: The bearings should have slight
interference fit in the knuckle when assembled. That's not difficult to
achieve during the first assembly, but during the second and subsequent???
From what I've seen & heard, egg-shaping of the knuckle is a far more
common failure mode than bearing failure, whether from grease deterioration
or contamination.
The ideal is to have had Zerk fittings installed during a careful "initial"
bearing assembly so the grease can periodically be flushed. Without that,
I'm in favor of periodic looseness checks (rock the wheel top-bottom to
check for play), and don't tamper with the bearings unless the play's
significant -- in which case, you need more than re-packed bearings. Of
course, there are other, less common failure indications, such as noise,
grease loss, or overheating, that must be watched for. But absent those,
why tamper with something that's working good?
What I would NOT do is risk polluting the grease and bearings with
abrasives, from the inevitably dirty undercarriage, by injecting grease
from the axle side of the hub.
JMHO about a fight in which I happily don't have a dog, since I installed
the 1-Ton front end. :-)
Ken H.
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #198947 is a reply to message #198917] |
Mon, 18 February 2013 19:02 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I figured we'd hear more squeals by now! :-)
Ken
On Mon, Feb 18, 2013 at 6:16 PM, Robert Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Ken,
>
> To expand on your email below from one of Dave Lenzi's presentations I
> remember he noted that the bore in the knuckle is cut with a
> pointed lathe tool. That results in a surface that is like saw teeth with
> peaks and valleys which has the effect of reducing the
> surface area that supports the bearings. The bearings beat into the top
> surface of the knuckle ID creating the egg shape you note
> below.
>
> He plasma sprays the bearing ID in the knuckle then grinds it to the
> correct dimension. The ground ID does not have saw teeth it is
> flat.
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> Sydney, Australia
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ken Henderson
>
> Johnny,
>
> Call me a Luddite, or whatever, but I just can't get into that "25,000 mile
> thing". Stop & think about it: The bearings should have slight
> interference fit in the knuckle when assembled. That's not difficult to
> achieve during the first assembly, but during the second and subsequent???
> From what I've seen & heard, egg-shaping of the knuckle is a far more
> common failure mode than bearing failure, whether from grease
> deterioration
> or contamination.
>
> The ideal is to have had Zerk fittings installed during a careful
> "initial"
> bearing assembly so the grease can periodically be flushed. Without that,
> I'm in favor of periodic looseness checks (rock the wheel top-bottom to
> check for play), and don't tamper with the bearings unless the play's
> significant -- in which case, you need more than re-packed bearings. Of
> course, there are other, less common failure indications, such as noise,
> grease loss, or overheating, that must be watched for. But absent those,
> why tamper with something that's working good?
>
> What I would NOT do is risk polluting the grease and bearings with
> abrasives, from the inevitably dirty undercarriage, by injecting grease
> from the axle side of the hub.
>
> JMHO about a fight in which I happily don't have a dog, since I installed
> the 1-Ton front end. :-)
>
> Ken H.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #199025 is a reply to message #198861] |
Tue, 19 February 2013 08:24 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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Well, the invoice says one side was replaaced, the opther new bearing only installed. At any rate, I currently have assymetric play in the front bearings, so I figure to get someone to pull them apart and see why. I've shied away from DIY front end work, just cos I don't fee comfortable doing it. Given current shop labor rates, I may overcome that discomfort.
I'm of two minds about modifngthe front. It runs and drives fine now, why make an 'orphan' out of it? The other side is, they're all prphans at this point, and there appears to be available a kit or two which make the mod at least do-able by the jacklegt mechanic (me). Having failed more than one front end under a V series Suburban, I've no illusions about 'better' or 'worse'. I submit I could bust either one equally well.
--johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
From: Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net>
To: gmclist <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2013 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do???
Johnny,
Call me a Luddite, or whatever, but I just can't get into that "25,000 mile
thing". Stop & think about it: The bearings should have slight
interference fit in the knuckle when assembled. That's not difficult to
achieve during the first assembly, but during the second and subsequent???
From what I've seen & heard, egg-shaping of the knuckle is a far more
common failure mode than bearing failure, whether from grease deterioration
or contamination.
The ideal is to have had Zerk fittings installed during a careful "initial"
bearing assembly so the grease can periodically be flushed. Without that,
I'm in favor of periodic looseness checks (rock the wheel top-bottom to
check for play), and don't tamper with the bearings unless the play's
significant -- in which case, you need more than re-packed bearings. Of
course, there are other, less common failure indications, such as noise,
grease loss, or overheating, that must be watched for. But absent those,
why tamper with something that's working good?
What I would NOT do is risk polluting the grease and bearings with
abrasives, from the inevitably dirty undercarriage, by injecting grease
from the axle side of the hub.
JMHO about a fight in which I happily don't have a dog, since I installed
the 1-Ton front end. :-)
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI+ & EBL
http://www.gmcwipersetc.com/
On Sun, Feb 17, 2013 at 12:44 PM, Johnny Bridges wrote:
> I'm holding the receipt where Sirum charged the PO to do the front end.
> I trust it. But they're coming due again..... sgh.
>
> From: Joe Kemenczky
> Yea Bill everyone says "if you haven't changed your front wheel bearings
> they haven't been changed!" Hopefully thats on my winter to do list.
> --
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: To be safe..Stay in budget...What would you do??? [message #199027 is a reply to message #198719] |
Tue, 19 February 2013 08:58 |
winter
Messages: 247
Registered: September 2007
Location: MPLS MN
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Joe,
A couple more things to inspect that doesn't cost much money:
Grease rear wheel bearings - you can pull them and regrease them for the cost of 4 seals. They can get rust pitting if they sit too long in one spot.
Check for cracked rubber fuel lines - It doesn't cost anything to inspect. If you do have a leak, the cost of leaking fuel is probably more than a new chunk of line.
Good Luck and enjoy. working on the beast is part of the fun.
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