| Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197710] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 15:09  |
mickey szilagyi
Messages: 273
Registered: January 2013
Karma: 0
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Still learning the ropes with our 77 Kingsley. We decided to replace the 16.5 steel wheels since we need new tires anyway and 16.5 tires are becoming harder to find. So, we just purchased 7 American Eagle aluminum wheels along with stainless steel valve stems, center caps, lugnuts and washers.
Then we stumble on the problem between SS and aluminum and galvanic corrosion. There are a lot of you out there with Alcoas and American Eagle aluminum wheels and SS hardward. Is there something we need to know and do to prevent this corrosion or is this not a problem?
Learning as we go and appreciate all your help.
Also in the market for 16 inch tires.
Mickey
77 Kingsley, Lansing MI
Mickey
1977 Kingsley, 403, Lansing, MI
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| Re: [GMCnet] Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197712 is a reply to message #197710] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 15:23  |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 1
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I'm sure someone will pipe up with facts but I believe the only issue with galvanic corrosion as far as aluminum wheels are concerned is if you used mild steel bolts. I think stainless and aluminum get along.
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 7, 2013, at 1:09 PM, Mickey Szilagyi <mickey@apex-internet.com> wrote:
>
>
> Still learning the ropes with our 77 Kingsley. We decided to replace the 16.5 steel wheels since we need new tires anyway and 16.5 tires are becoming harder to find. So, we just purchased 7 American Eagle aluminum wheels along with stainless steel valve stems, center caps, lugnuts and washers.
>
> Then we stumble on the problem between SS and aluminum and galvanic corrosion. There are a lot of you out there with Alcoas and American Eagle aluminum wheels and SS hardward. Is there something we need to know and do to prevent this corrosion or is this not a problem?
>
> Learning as we go and appreciate all your help.
> Also in the market for 16 inch tires.
>
> Mickey
> 77 Kingsley, Lansing MI
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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| Re: Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197714 is a reply to message #197710] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 15:43 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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As far as the stems, isn't there a rubber gasket and no metal to metal contact. I have Alcoas and have not seen corrosion at the lugs. I think the Alcoa lugs are hi grade steel and black phosphate treated i do remember Ford had problem in the 70s on the big cars with aluminum wheels rotting to the hubs. You could take the lug nuts off and still drive the car, Couldn't change a flat. Not sure how many GMCs are driven in road salt all winter so I wouldn't worry about it.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197716 is a reply to message #197710] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 15:58 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Mickey,
We could engage in a highly technical discussion about galvanic corrosion between stainless and forged aluminum, however, lets use
the KISS principle.
It seems to me that if there was a problem of galvanic corrosion between the stainless steel parts you noted below and the aluminum
wheels it would be foolish to manufacture or supply them.
I have Kuhmo Road Vantage AT tread tires on Double Trouble and am very happy with them.
Regards,
Rob M.
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: Mickey Szilagyi
Still learning the ropes with our 77 Kingsley. We decided to replace the 16.5 steel wheels since we need new tires anyway and 16.5
tires are becoming harder to find. So, we just purchased 7 American Eagle aluminum wheels along with stainless steel valve stems,
center caps, lugnuts and washers.
Then we stumble on the problem between SS and aluminum and galvanic corrosion. There are a lot of you out there with Alcoas and
American Eagle aluminum wheels and SS hardward. Is there something we need to know and do to prevent this corrosion or is this not
a problem?
Learning as we go and appreciate all your help.
Also in the market for 16 inch tires.
Mickey
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Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197726 is a reply to message #197716] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 18:18 |
John Sharpe
Messages: 489
Registered: February 2006
Location: Texas
Karma: 1
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| Quote: |
....the problem between SS and aluminum and galvanic corrosion. ......
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The worst combination with aluminum is copper & Brass. There's a reason Alcoa specifies chrome valve stems. They are actually chrome plated brass. Brass (copper n tin)should not be in contact with your aluminum. I would not worry so much about stainless as it is not that far on the galvanic table from aluminum.Google it.
John Sharpe
Humble,TX
'78 Eleganza TBI
'89 Spectrum 2000 MPI V-10
'40 Ford Panel Delivery TPI
johnasharpe@gmail.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197733 is a reply to message #197712] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 19:00 |
78 Barbi
Messages: 80
Registered: August 2004
Location: Tiverton, Ontario , Canad...
Karma: -1
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Sully wrote : I'm sure someone will pipe up with facts but I believe the only issue with galvanic corrosion as far as aluminum wheels are concerned is if you used mild steel bolts. I think stainless and aluminum get along.
Hi Sully,
Stainless steel and aluminum are fine together provided the interface can readily dry out between wettings. As in out stainless lug nut covers for our Alcoa wheels. HOWEVER as can be seen below , galvanic action CAN and WILL occur if the interface can't dry out. We are issuing a SERVICE BULLETIN : AB-001 in the next week to 10 days to our website regarding potential seizure problems on our stainless park brake cables.
Cheers .....Albert Branscombe
78 Barbi....The 23 foot Birchaven
Tiverton, ON, CAN
Risks associated with insufficient “ field” sealing of parking brake conduit bellows boots thus allowing moisture infiltration to conduit .
Identified Problem : Over the last short while ( latter half of 2012 ) there has been 3 instances brought to my attention of partially or totally seized parking brake cables inside their protective conduits. Although this is less than a 1 % failure rate, ANY failure rate is UNACCEPTABLE !
There are presently about 450 SS conduit / cable assemblies in the field and due to the above statement ; They should be checked regularly for freedom of movement. At the frame end of the conduit / cable assembly is a threaded aluminum bushing that attaches the conduit to the GMC frame bracket. Approx. 1.25" of the inner bore of this bushing is in potential physical and electrical contact with the 1/8" dia. stainless cable strand that passes thru it. Add water ; Especially water with trace amounts of salt in it and galvanic action can and will eventually form a coating on the stainless strand and seize it in the bushing. Lab analysis has confirmed the white dense compound to be alumina ( Al2 O3 ) , this is essentially a ceramic compound and has the ability to completely seize the cable.
We consulted chemical engineers during the original design and were informed that galvanic corrosion could be prevented by keeping the bushings dry. This is why we selected a boot that would prevent water intrusion if properly installed. Good quality neoprene bellows boots were procured from Wescon Products in Kansas and a method was devised to seal the joint against water infiltration. It appears that the “ Nylon Snapper Clamp” at the cable end of the boot is not being completely done up in the field or in one case , being completely left off the boot.
The bellows boot of course will retain water inside it if not properly sealed due to its accordion structure and this will result in certain galvanic action occurring.
WHAT ARE WE DOING ABOUT THIS PROBLEM ?
First of all: Bring to your attention the fact that it’s imperative that the bellows boot is fully sealed against moisture infiltration by ensuring the “ Snapper Clamps” are fully engaged ( ie. All 6 teeth engaged) , Secondly : That you should inspect the conduit bushing regularly for signs of moisture and the presence of any white powder at the end of the bushing. Thirdly: Check the cable strand for freedom of movement regularly . The entire conduit is teflon lined , the only parts of the conduit that wasn’t lined was the bushings at the forward frame bracket and the backing plate.
As of October 1st. , 2012 all conduit assemblies will have their bushings fully dielectric sleeved to prevent any possibility of galvanic action in spite of boot sealing problems that may occur in the field AND this dissertation will accompany all kits being sold. This “ Heads Up” will also be posted on our website and anywhere else deemed helpful.
If after careful inspection ; you find or suspect a sealing problem that has impaired freedom of movement of your cables, remove the conduits ( either 2 or 4 conduits depending upon your kit) and return them to us at “ your cost ” and ; I will rehab or replace the conduits with dielectric sleeved conduit bushings and ensure there are no defects in the assemblies and return them to you at “our cost ” . In a “perfect world” the conduit manufacturer would not have used aluminum and stainless together , even though it’s often done in the aerospace industry. I suppose the conduit manufacturer imagined his products would be shown off on a hot rod or muscle car cruising down Woodward Avenue on a sunny Saturday afternoon, not on some GMC that has been parked on the beach on South San Padre Island for 3 months in a salt water atmosphere. Keep in mind ; Dry boots - no galvanic action! Alas : Sorry for any inconvenience. Sincerely .....................Albert Branscombe ......branscoa@bmts.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197737 is a reply to message #197733] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 19:15 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Albert,
My compliments on your prompt attention to the problem! I know it's tough
to have to make such and announcement, especially for someone who's been as
fastidious about every aspect of your products as you've been.
Guess it makes you appreciate the problems of the automobile manufacturers,
doesn't it? Imagine having ALL the parts to worry about! :-(
Thanks for Doing the Right Thing.
Ken H.
On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 8:00 PM, Albert&Sheila Branscombe wrote:
>
> ...
We are issuing a SERVICE BULLETIN : AB-001 in the next week to 10 days to
> our website regarding potential seizure problems on our stainless park
> brake cables.
...
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197744 is a reply to message #197714] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 19:57 |
mickey szilagyi
Messages: 273
Registered: January 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Yes, there is a rubber gasket on the SS valve stems so there shouldn't be any contact between them and the wheels. The center caps are SS and will be in contact with the aluminum wheels. Most of the time they should be dry and we don't plan on using the coach in the winter when salt is present on the roads. We assume the manufacturers of all these aluminum wheels would warn against using stainless hardware if it was a potential problem. We are not aware of any such warning. Hopefully this assumption won't come back to bite us in the future. It sounds like most of you agree there shouldn't be a problem with the SS and aluminum combination on wheels and hardware.
Thanks for all the input.
Mickey
Mickey
1977 Kingsley, 403, Lansing, MI
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| Re: Galvanic Reaction Between Stainless Steel and Aluminum [message #197757 is a reply to message #197710] |
Thu, 07 February 2013 21:50 |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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| Mickey Szilagyi wrote on Thu, 07 February 2013 15:09 |
Still learning the ropes with our 77 Kingsley. We decided to replace the 16.5 steel wheels since we need new tires anyway and 16.5 tires are becoming harder to find. So, we just purchased 7 American Eagle aluminum wheels along with stainless steel valve stems, center caps, lugnuts and washers.
Then we stumble on the problem between SS and aluminum and galvanic corrosion. There are a lot of you out there with Alcoas and American Eagle aluminum wheels and SS hardward. Is there something we need to know and do to prevent this corrosion or is this not a problem?
Learning as we go and appreciate all your help.
Also in the market for 16 inch tires.
Mickey
77 Kingsley, Lansing MI
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Well, some type of corrosion existed between my Alcoa wheels and the face of the hub. So, I cleaned both surfaces and used anti-sieze between the two when I re-installed the wheels. One of my wheels was well stuck --
Dennis
Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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