Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Re: [GMCnet] Old coaches vs new 'stuff'
| Re: [GMCnet] Old coaches vs new 'stuff' [message #193807] |
Sun, 23 December 2012 14:07  |
rallymaster
Messages: 662
Registered: February 2004
Location: North Plains, ORYGUN
Karma: -4
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Senior Member |
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Problem with this is that often the OBDII readout has nothing to do with
the problem you're experiencing, except when the only noticeable problem
is that the Check engine light is on.
Our Suzuki misfires every couple of minutes. The CEL was on, and the
shop said "this gizmo" was bad. They replaced "this gizmo" for a couple
of hundred bucks, and before I got home she started misfiring again. But
the CEL was off. Still misfiring, but no CEL, and I haven't had time to
try again.
RonC
On Sun, 23 Dec 2012 09:20:43 -0500 Mike Teets <teamteets@gmail.com>
writes:
> I see a lot of folks here say "you can't fix the new stuff". After
> building cars from scratch in the 70's, the first computer
> controlled cars
> of the 90's left me feeling lost even as a technology guy. However,
> most
> cars now have gone to the standard OBDII or EOBD for European cars.
> (On
> board diagnostics). The scanners are between $30 and $100. Plug in
> your
> scanner to your laptop and it will likely tell you exactly where the
> fault
> is. You may have to do an internet search or two. After that, it
> is
> often just the case of unscrewing a sensor and replacing it! New
> RV's are
> likely much less standard than autos, but I find I can now fix just
> about
> everything on new GM cars.
>
> Mike, Dublin OH, 77 PB
>
>
Ron & Linda Clark
1978 Eleganza II
North Plains, ORYGUN
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Ron & Linda Clark
North Plains, ORYGUN
78 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Old coaches vs new 'stuff' [message #193810 is a reply to message #193807] |
Sun, 23 December 2012 14:55  |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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One of my fellow VT instructors (Auto Repair) had a brand new T top Camaro
with the Batch fire port injection. It ran like crap on the way back from
Seattle, and the locking torque converter wouldn"t. Still under Warranty,
he took it to the Dealership. They plugged it in, and their fancyass
machine said it was one of the vacuum operated air controls on the
intake. The tech replaced it, a couple of hundred under warranty. It still
ran like crap. He asked me to look at it. I checked the vacuum hose that
operated the air control, and it was split along the seam. Replaced the
metric sized hose, and yep, that fixed the problem. The trans no lock up
turned out to be a VSS that failed to send a signal to the CM and the
torque converter would not lockup. Fixed the electrical connector, and that
fixed the problem. Both faults were found by a tech (me) that had good
diagnostic skills, as well as a working knowledge of the electronics
involved. New techs are only trained in the test equipment operation and
computer controls. They have to look for split hoses the hard way.
Experience, there is not any substitute for it. After the new stuff gets a
few miles on it and the rubber and plastic pieces start to deteriorate all
bets are off. But to give credit where it is due, new stuff runs great for
longer than the stuff built in the 70s. No tune ups or high oil consumption
until the mileage is well over 100,000 miles for the most part.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403
On Sun, Dec 23, 2012 at 12:07 PM, <rallymaster@juno.com> wrote:
> Problem with this is that often the OBDII readout has nothing to do with
> the problem you're experiencing, except when the only noticeable problem
> is that the Check engine light is on.
> Our Suzuki misfires every couple of minutes. The CEL was on, and the
> shop said "this gizmo" was bad. They replaced "this gizmo" for a couple
> of hundred bucks, and before I got home she started misfiring again. But
> the CEL was off. Still misfiring, but no CEL, and I haven't had time to
> try again.
>
> RonC
>
>
> On Sun, 23 Dec 2012 09:20:43 -0500 Mike Teets <teamteets@gmail.com>
> writes:
> > I see a lot of folks here say "you can't fix the new stuff". After
> > building cars from scratch in the 70's, the first computer
> > controlled cars
> > of the 90's left me feeling lost even as a technology guy. However,
> > most
> > cars now have gone to the standard OBDII or EOBD for European cars.
> > (On
> > board diagnostics). The scanners are between $30 and $100. Plug in
> > your
> > scanner to your laptop and it will likely tell you exactly where the
> > fault
> > is. You may have to do an internet search or two. After that, it
> > is
> > often just the case of unscrewing a sensor and replacing it! New
> > RV's are
> > likely much less standard than autos, but I find I can now fix just
> > about
> > everything on new GM cars.
> >
> > Mike, Dublin OH, 77 PB
> >
> >
> Ron & Linda Clark
> 1978 Eleganza II
> North Plains, ORYGUN
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Old coaches vs new 'stuff' [message #193813 is a reply to message #193807] |
Sun, 23 December 2012 15:09 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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| rallymaster wrote on Sun, 23 December 2012 14:07 |
Problem with this is that often the OBDII readout has nothing to do with
the problem you're experiencing, ...
|
How true. My favorite horror story follows.
I've been a GM guy forever. Bought 8 new vehicles (well over 100K worth) over the years from a dealer where my Sister-in-law has worked for 40+ years. I've known the owner since 1972 when he was dirty fingernail mechanic at a gas station.
Back when my business was going good, I ran up and down the interstate going to events pulling a 7000 lb trailer. Had a 2001 GMC with the 5.3 in it but mainly pulled the trailer with a Ford 1 ton dually diesel. In 2007, GMC introduced their heavy duty towing package with a 6 liter "Vortec MAX" engine and advance engine management (switches to 4 cyl electronically). Had to have it and sold my dually.
Shortly thereafter on a trip to NY with the trailer, I noticed what felt like a miss just when the engine would start to pull. Also the mileage with an empty flatbed trailer dropped to 12mpg and 10 with about a 5000 lb trailer. Figured it was a bad plug so I took it in. Came back no problem found. Took the service rep (who I know personally) for a ride and he felt it too. He went and got his super-duper-interglactic-plutonimum 237-Space-Modulator ODBII scanner and we went for a ride again. Felt the problem....no problem found.
So he says he needs to do some investigation and a couple days later he calls me back and says it's "NORMAL" for that truck with that engine. In other words they all do it, which I verified by driving two more. My response was "OK, I can accept it is a 'class' problem which makes it 'normal', but that doesn't mean it is right. He didn't know how to fix it and kicked it up the factory rep. He and I kicked it around a few calls and he told me if I didn't drop it he would void my warranty. Yep, he said that in front of witnesses.
I went to my 'friend' the dealer owner and explained just in case he had not been paying attention that I'd given him well over 100K in sales and purchased 8 new cars and expected him to step in. He responded that it was a factory problem and there wasn't anything he could do.
Needless to say this is my last GM vehicle. Other than this 'chuggle' as they call it and the sucky mileage it's been a good truck. Every time I see one of the red MAX on the trucks I ask the owner about it and they basically report the same thing. The problem is in the programming of the computers and they're not willing to fix it. I suspect it's an emission and mileage thing that would get them in trouble with the EPA.
No way in God's green acre can I fix this but if were points, plugs, and a carb it would be a different story because there are only 4-5 variables to resolve. Admittedly the electronic engine management is nice but it has it's price and in the case of this particular combination I don't even get that good mileage. About 17 around town and 19.5 on the interstate. Put a load behind it and the mileage will drop by half. Better than carbs but not by much and loaded it's not as good. $$&^^$#))*
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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