Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE
| [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #180805] |
Sun, 19 August 2012 09:38  |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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Let me say this about that.
WE NEED A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION
That is why I have been a paying member of GMCMI, for almost 20 years.
.
BUT
GMCMI is the only organization that I know of that:
- holds hostage, *OUR* GMC technical information
- FOREVER (not just a year)
- I cannot point to (a url) for a reference in GMCMI
- I only point to information (I don't write it)
If I point to an article on Power Master Brakes (1990)
by MARVIN PECK - GMC CLASSIC
( a wonderful collection of documentation with manuals, part numbers,
hints, problems , etc)
this is what you will get
http://www.gmcmi.com/mem-bers/TechHandouts
/Powermaster.pdf
OR
http://goo.gl/lyAFq
and
7,000 GMCers, cannot read it
this excellent information has been
*--"held hostage for 22 years"*--
--------------------------------
Now GMCES has an excellent model where technical information is held
"Member only" for one year,and then it is released.
http://www.gmceast.com/technical/
Nice Job Byron, and a good precedent for all of our membership
organizations.
with hope for change
gene
-
>
> That certainly doesn't sound like the presentation is being held "captive"
> and quite frankly I am getting tired of having that statement posted on the
> GMC net.
> It is past the "cute" point.
>
>
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #180828 is a reply to message #180805] |
Sun, 19 August 2012 15:44  |
zhagrieb
Messages: 676
Registered: August 2009
Location: Portland Oregon
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I wasn't aware that ANY info was "held hostage" for any period of time and am curious why. It's not as if there's a world of rogue non members waiting to pounce. Seems to me we should be willing to share with any GMC owner whether a member or not. It's in everyone's best interest
Glenn
Glenn Giere, Portland OR, K7GAG
'73 "Moby the Motorhome" 26'
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #180834 is a reply to message #180828] |
Sun, 19 August 2012 16:14 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Glenn,
The rationale, at least for the GMC Parts Interchange List, is that the
list is complied and updated at GMCMI expense (part of Billy Massey's job
as GMCMI Member Services manager) and therefore the "property" of the
membership. Granted the information itself is public knowledge and comes
from individual contributions, but the compilation and maintenance are paid
for by members. Their access to that list is a valuable benefit of
membership.
It is with some trepidation that I support any limitation of access to ANY
information, but the fact is that for some people, that's sufficient
incentive to join the club. I favor putting the list on line, but in that
event, I would still favor restricting its access to members and
prohibiting downloading in the interest of preventing "pirating".
The seminar materials are in a slightly different category. That
information is not subsidized by the club and is the sole property of the
author/presenter. It is solely their right to decide where it will be
posted. If they choose to allow GMCMI to post it, that's fine. If they
then release it freely to the "whole world", that's fine also; some will
make the effort to do so, others will not. In some cases they will
restrict access to GMCMI in order to help promote GMCMI membership. In
others they simply won't bother to put it anywhere else. Others, including
some of our most prominent technical experts, don't want their
presentations posted at all. Not necessarily because they want the
information to be withheld, but because they want to neither defend nor
support it.
That's the world as I've seen it.
JMHO,
Ken H.
Americus, GA
GMCMI VP SE
On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 4:44 PM, Glenn Giere wrote:
>
>
> I wasn't aware that ANY info was "held hostage" for any period of time and
> am curious why. It's not as if there's a world of rogue non members
> waiting to pounce. Seems to me we should be willing to share with any GMC
> owner whether a member or not. It's in everyone's best interest
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #180849 is a reply to message #180834] |
Sun, 19 August 2012 18:24 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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I guess by this definition, the information on Jim Bounds' "Member Section" is being "held hostage" too. I believe he has every right to reserve certain information for paying members of the Co-op. By the same token, I don't see a problem with GMCMI doing the same thing. GMCMI membership costs $30.00 per year and is well worth it. By the way, membership to the Co-op costs $40.00 per year.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #180989 is a reply to message #180980] |
Mon, 20 August 2012 19:30 |
Mike Teets
Messages: 299
Registered: January 2004
Location: Dublin, OH
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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This discussion is almost identical to the "open access" debate going on in
the academic community. There are billions of dollars wrapped up in the
debate. Search google for "open access" and visit the first several links
to a primer on the tradeoffs. The wikipedia article is good.
For me, where the GMC is mostly a means to an end... gmc club membership
and rallies don't meet my needs. The most useful resources for me has been
this list, Gene Fisher's website, and the people that collaborate online.
I hope that I carry my weight by publishing my share, or in open access
terminology, self-archiving.
I would like to take this opportunity to thank Gene, Bdub, the participants
here, the two Jim's, and those who reply through direct messages with
valuable information. The last 10 years of enjoyable GMC ownership have
been made possible for me for their actions.
Mike
Dublin, OH
teamteets.com
On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 7:54 PM, Matt Colie <matt7323tze@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> John Ruff wrote on Mon, 20 August 2012 17:47
> > Using this logic - only people who belong to churches should have access
> to bibles :)
> >
> > The churches didn't write it - and most share them freely :)
>
> Actually John,
>
> The Church of Rome has a vast library that nobody below cardinal pay grade
> is allowed to access.
>
> I think GMCMI gives out plenty of information already. If having that
> list at thirty dollars (US) per year is too expensive for you, then I
> seriously think you should take up something else.
>
> Matt
> --
> Matt & Mary Colie
> '73 Glacier 23 Chaumière (say show-me-air) Just about as stock as you will
> find
> SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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Mike, GMCing since 2002
77 Palm Beach, 260, 403
Dublin, OH
http://teamteets.com/gmc/
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #180990 is a reply to message #180989] |
Mon, 20 August 2012 19:34 |
rssbob
Messages: 259
Registered: January 2004
Location: La Mesa, Ca. (San Diego a...
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Mike, You hit the nail right on the head with that one. Thanks you guys.
Bob Sobrito
1978 Palm Beach
La Mesa, Ca
On Aug 20, 2012, at 5:30 PM, Mike Teets wrote:
> This discussion is almost identical to the "open access" debate going on in
> the academic community. There are billions of dollars wrapped up in the
> debate. Search google for "open access" and visit the first several links
> to a primer on the tradeoffs. The wikipedia article is good.
>
> For me, where the GMC is mostly a means to an end... gmc club membership
> and rallies don't meet my needs. The most useful resources for me has been
> this list, Gene Fisher's website, and the people that collaborate online.
> I hope that I carry my weight by publishing my share, or in open access
> terminology, self-archiving.
>
> I would like to take this opportunity to thank Gene, Bdub, the participants
> here, the two Jim's, and those who reply through direct messages with
> valuable information. The last 10 years of enjoyable GMC ownership have
> been made possible for me for their actions.
>
> Mike
> Dublin, OH
> teamteets.com
>
> On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 7:54 PM, Matt Colie <matt7323tze@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> John Ruff wrote on Mon, 20 August 2012 17:47
>>> Using this logic - only people who belong to churches should have access
>> to bibles :)
>>>
>>> The churches didn't write it - and most share them freely :)
>>
>> Actually John,
>>
>> The Church of Rome has a vast library that nobody below cardinal pay grade
>> is allowed to access.
>>
>> I think GMCMI gives out plenty of information already. If having that
>> list at thirty dollars (US) per year is too expensive for you, then I
>> seriously think you should take up something else.
>>
>> Matt
>> --
>> Matt & Mary Colie
>> '73 Glacier 23 Chaumière (say show-me-air) Just about as stock as you will
>> find
>> SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
antique pocket watch repair
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Bob Sobrito
78 Palm Beach
La Mesa, Ca
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #181031 is a reply to message #180805] |
Mon, 20 August 2012 23:42 |
59ona64
Messages: 41
Registered: July 2012
Location: United States
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Ken,
Come on over to our church. I'll give you a Bible, then take you and your family to lunch, because I really like people and love hearing their stories.
I was looking at different motorhomes (Argosy, Barth, Ultravan, Foretravel, Clark), but have decided to buy a GMC because of the incredible amount of information on this forum and on Gene Fishers (sp?) photo-tutorial site, and the generosity of the people in the GMC world. The Black List!?!?!? Insane! You are all some of the most generous people I have ever come across, and I work in the church/non-profit world, where EVERYTHING we do is because of the generosity of people.
You all are the reason we'll purchase a GMC. And I actually believe a short Barth or Argosy would work better for my purposes, but not without your help maintaining it. Shoot, now I'm simply going to have a better driving, better handling, more reliable coach...life is good!
Dave >Wannabe< Scottsdale, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #181036 is a reply to message #181025] |
Tue, 21 August 2012 00:47 |
Coelli
Messages: 136
Registered: July 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Ken Burton wrote on Mon, 20 August 2012 20:46 |
So I was going to go look at Barnes and Noble. Then I remembered that the local Barnes and Noble store went out of business. Maybe they were handing out free bibles.
|
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/10
Here ya go - free, online, King James version. Pick your format and away you go!
We plan to join GMCMI for access to the information, but I just want to point out that membership to the FMCA is a requirement so the first year will actually cost you $80 ($50 FMCA and $30 GMCMI), and $70 a year thereafter. Looks like GMCMI has some grest stuff though judging by the index - as new owners of less than 2 weeks we're eager to dive in once we get all the memberships straightened out. This list/forum and all the other websites have been great resources though. Would love to have everything in a wiki!
Meghan
1976 Eleganza II, Los Angeles, CA
Classic GMC Motorhomes Group on Facebook
[Updated on: Tue, 21 August 2012 00:49] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] INFO HELD HOSTAGE [message #181038 is a reply to message #181036] |
Tue, 21 August 2012 01:49 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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You have a valid point on the FMCA charge. I did get a free cup holder for them one time.
On the free bible you are going to give me, I'll bet the church had to buy them so it would be no different than me paying someone's dues to GMCMI and them saying they got it free.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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