| Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171708] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 00:52  |
rileysgmc
Messages: 27
Registered: May 2012
Location: west texas
Karma: 0
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I had planned to have electric brakes installed on my boat trailer for my gmc to tow the boat, but the brake shop is saying I need a whole new axel. $2500.00 plus labor, and a 3-4 month wait! Will surge brakes be ok to use in place of electric? I don't want to "stress" out the Motorhome!
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| Re: Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171709 is a reply to message #171708] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 01:07  |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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| rileysgmc wrote on Sat, 02 June 2012 00:52 |
I had planned to have electric brakes installed on my boat trailer for my gmc to tow the boat, but the brake shop is saying I need a whole new axel. $2500.00 plus labor, and a 3-4 month wait! Will surge brakes be ok to use in place of electric? I don't want to "stress" out the Motorhome!
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They both work about the same. Surge brakes are nothing more than a master cylinder mounted on the trailer tongue that gets pressed in when the boat (and trailer) are moving forward faster than the towing vehicle. This then applies the brakes on the trailer. The one minor drawback with surge brakes is you must get out and disable them before you back up. It is simply flipping a lever or pressing a button.
Unless the trailer is over 3000 pounds, I would not bother installing either kind.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171713 is a reply to message #171710] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 01:43 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Yes, the Surge brakes are hydraulically operated drum brakes and the electric ones are obviously electric operated drum brakes.
You will need new backing plates to mount the shoes and then new drums, probably with bearings, for either kind.
I do not know what kind of axles you have but you should be able to find the required parts to match you existing axles on ebay. You might also try a local farm store like TSC for what you need.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171729 is a reply to message #171717] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 07:21 |
Kingsley Coach
Messages: 2691
Registered: March 2009
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Karma: -34
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I've always assumed that water and electric didn't mix well. That would
suggest you go to the surge brake....the hunt for the best price is next !
Mike in NS
On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 5:17 AM, Ed <wandering673@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Surge brakes are preferred on a boat trailer since submerging the electrics
> isn't such a good idea. They're also easier to wire on your GMC's side
> which
> will need updating to use the brakes.
>
> I have electric brakes on my flatbed/car carrier and surge brakes on my
> boat
> trailer.
>
> For the surge brakes you will require at minimum a 5 pin connector on your
> tow vehicle (in this case the GMC), the 5th pin connects to the reverse
> lights and locks out the brakes in order to allow you to back up without
> the
> trailer brakes applying.
>
> Electric brakes will require you to install a 6 or 7 pin on the tow vehicle
> (the 7 preferred and required if you want the ability to use both types of
> trailer brakes), You will also need to install a brake controller and extra
> wiring from the battery. I recently had this done on my truck and it ran
> about $300. Probably a little higher for the longer wire run on the GMC.
>
> Both types of brakes can be installed without replacing the axle. Rather
> than a brake shop, I'd suggest looking for a place that specializes in
> trailer sales and repair. They have more specific knowledge on the subject
> and could give you a second opinion as to whether replacing the entire axle
> would be needed.
>
> Ed
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of stephen and natasha
> Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2012 10:22 AM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: [GMCnet] Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing
>
>
>
> I had planned to have electric brakes installed on my boat trailer for my
> gmc to tow the boat, but the brake shop is saying I need a whole new axel.
> $2500.00 plus labor, and a 3-4 month wait! Will surge brakes be ok to use
> in
> place of electric? I don't want to "stress" out the Motorhome!
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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--
Michael Beaton
1977 Kingsley 26-11
1977 Eleganza II 26-3
Antigonish, NS
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| Re: Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171753 is a reply to message #171713] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 09:59 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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| Ken Burton wrote on Fri, 01 June 2012 23:43 |
Yes, the Surge brakes are hydraulically operated drum brakes and the electric ones are obviously electric operated drum brakes.
You will need new backing plates to mount the shoes and then new drums, probably with bearings, for either kind.
I do not know what kind of axles you have but you should be able to find the required parts to match you existing axles on ebay. You might also try a local farm store like TSC for what you need.
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Steve,
Most trailer axles, that I have seen anyway, have a four bolt flange behind the spindle. The flange is there to accommodate the brake backing plate. I suppose there are axles that are not built this way, and if you have one, I think you would need to change out the axle in order to add brakes of any kind
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: [GMCnet] Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171761 is a reply to message #171708] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 11:04 |
Dave Mumert
Messages: 272
Registered: February 2004
Location: Olds, AB, Canada
Karma: 0
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Hi
You might check to be sure your axles do not have the brake flange. It is
just a square plate with 4 holes welded to the axle just behind the hub. I
think they flange is about 4 inches square. If they have the flange you
will just need the brake and hub.
Dexter axle is also a good source, they may have a distributor near you.
http://www.dexteraxle.com
They also have marine grade axles.
Southwest Wheel has a trailer division
http://www.trailerpart.com/
They have all the brake parts and non-marine axles.
http://stores.ebay.com/R-and-P-Carriages-Trailer-Sales
These people sell weld on backing plates for less than $6.00 each. If you
know a welder you can trust you could maybe have backing plates welded on.
Dave
> Subject: [GMCnet] Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing
>
> I had planned to have electric brakes installed on my boat trailer for my
gmc
> to tow the boat, but the brake shop is saying I need a whole new axel.
> $2500.00 plus labor, and a 3-4 month wait! Will surge brakes be ok to use
in
> place of electric? I don't want to "stress" out the Motorhome!
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171774 is a reply to message #171708] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 12:57 |
Adrien G.
Messages: 474
Registered: May 2008
Location: Burns Flat, OK 73624
Karma: 1
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Stephen,
NO ELECTRIC, as said. Water, rust and electricity are problems in the making.
Surge have some drawbacks which can be overcome, backing up in rough parking or curb, on hwys that are wavy will cause a pull-push feel while driving.
The best kind of brake actuator IMO is from Carlisle, it works so well that you don't feel it being applied, it work forward or reverse, on drums or disc. With brake-away feature.
http://www.carlislebrake.com/products/trailer-brake-actuators/
Now, I've put my few cent in the subject, FWIW.
Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
75 Glenbrook (26-3) Mods LS3.70 FD / Reaction Sys / 80mm Front&Intermidiate / Hydroboost / 16" Tires / Frame Rebuild / Interior Rebuild
Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
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| Re: Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171777 is a reply to message #171745] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 14:31 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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The only reason I asked for the tire and wheel information was to try to figure out what kind of axle we are dealing with. Once we know that we can probably come up with some kind of specific trailer brake information.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Surge vs electric brakes for boat towing [message #171828 is a reply to message #171796] |
Sat, 02 June 2012 23:29 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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| rileysgmc wrote on Sat, 02 June 2012 19:27 |
Ken the tires say 7.00-15
My husband says that's a 15" rim. The lug was 5
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Wow! With that size of tire, that has to be an old, old trailer. I was not expecting that. This may explain why someone wanted to change out the axles.
Now lets see if we can find a set of drums, backing plates, and brakes to fit that style.
The closest modern size to a 7.00x15 tire would be a ST225/75-15. These tires can fit on a 6 to 7 inch wide rim. But they are a little taller at 28.1 inches versus 27.88 for a 7.00x15. I think they are rated at around 2250 pounds each at around 65 PSI.
If the wheel is less width then an ST205/75-15 should be used with a weight rating of around 1850 pounds per tire.
Is there a brand name and weight rating anywhere on the trailer?
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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