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| [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140403] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 08:07  |
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Tangerine
Messages: 192
Registered: February 2004
Location: Livonia, MI
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Hi All
I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was
hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace the
O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a little
while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of
O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these successfully?? Is
there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size
O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
. ___________
./_][__][] []| 1974 GMC M/H
.*O-------OO-* Painted Desert
"Tangerine Dream" W/New Frame
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1974 GMC 260
Tangerine Dream
Livonia Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140405 is a reply to message #140403] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 08:19  |
Keith V
Messages: 2337
Registered: March 2008
Location: Mounds View,MN
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| Tangerine wrote on Mon, 22 August 2011 08:07 |
Hi All
I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was
hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace the
O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a little
while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of
O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these successfully?? Is
there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size
O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
. ___________
./_][__][] []| 1974 GMC M/H
.*O-------OO-* Painted Desert
"Tangerine Dream" W/New Frame
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I rebuilt mine and they kinda work.
I had a leak in the left side I could not fix I ended up epoxying the 2 halves together. Now it doesn't leak at least.
But hold doesn't work on the left side. If you leave the valve in hold it raises overnite.
My o-rings are a little too thick I think, so hold doesn't return to position very well.
Maybe you can find a used pair?
Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140406 is a reply to message #140403] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 08:21 |
GMC Cruse
Messages: 606
Registered: June 2009
Location: SE Michigan
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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| Tangerine wrote on Mon, 22 August 2011 09:07 |
Hi All
I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was
hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace the
O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a little
while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of
O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these successfully?? Is
there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size
O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
. ___________
./_][__][] []| 1974 GMC M/H
.*O-------OO-* Painted Desert
"Tangerine Dream" W/New Frame
Jim K. has rebuilt sets for $20 consisting of gaskets and o-rings.
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Mike K.
'75 PB
Southeast Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140421 is a reply to message #140403] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 09:30 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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| Tangerine wrote on Mon, 22 August 2011 06:07 |
There are 2 sizes of
O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these successfully?? Is
there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size
O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
. ___________
./_][__][] []| 1974 GMC M/H
.*O-------OO-* Painted Desert
"Tangerine Dream" W/New Frame
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JimK has a kit. I did mine and they are working well.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140428 is a reply to message #140403] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 09:55 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Gary et All,
The Skinner solenoid valves both the 2 way & 3 way are rebuildable and
kits are available. I have rebuilt a large number of these in my
tech support days many years ago. There are a few special tools that
make it easy to disassemble and reassemble the units, but if care is
taken on taking it apart you can be successful. GMCMHI newsletter
Issue 82, page 4 list the part numbers and cost (2004) for these
items. The O-ring are a special size and only available in the kit or
someone like Motion Industries and you would have to match up with
what you have to what them have in stock. ( <http://www.motionindustries.com/motion3/jsp/mii/index.html
> ) The Kit for the 2-way is part number C60-S001 and you will need
2 and the kit for the 3-way is part number C60-S0005 and you will need
4. You should be able get them from John Henry Foster Co. ( <http://www.jhf.com/index.asp
> ) You can call and see if these numbers are still valid and
available or they cross to a new number. The Skinner solenoid part
numbers are for the 2 say is C2DA1251 and the 3-way is C4DK1150 and
again these may need to be cross referenced as Skinner changed there
part number several years back. Call John Henry and see.
Regards,
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
78 Buskirk 30' Stretch
1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
> Hi All
> I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was
> hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace the
> O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a little
> while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of
> O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these
> successfully?? Is
> there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size
> O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
>
> Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140431 is a reply to message #140428] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 10:01 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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I should have added that you should check with the Jim's and see if
they have the rebuild kits for the solenoids. Their cost may be less
than the industrial supplier.
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
78 Buskirk 30' Stretch
1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
On Aug 22, 2011, at 10:55 AM, John Wright wrote:
> Gary et All,
> The Skinner solenoid valves both the 2 way & 3 way are rebuildable and
> kits are available. I have rebuilt a large number of these in my
> tech support days many years ago. There are a few special tools that
> make it easy to disassemble and reassemble the units, but if care is
> taken on taking it apart you can be successful. GMCMHI newsletter
> Issue 82, page 4 list the part numbers and cost (2004) for these
> items. The O-ring are a special size and only available in the kit or
> someone like Motion Industries and you would have to match up with
> what you have to what them have in stock. ( <http://www.motionindustries.com/motion3/jsp/mii/index.html
>> ) The Kit for the 2-way is part number C60-S001 and you will need
> 2 and the kit for the 3-way is part number C60-S0005 and you will need
> 4. You should be able get them from John Henry Foster Co. ( <http://www.jhf.com/index.asp
>> ) You can call and see if these numbers are still valid and
> available or they cross to a new number. The Skinner solenoid part
> numbers are for the 2 say is C2DA1251 and the 3-way is C4DK1150 and
> again these may need to be cross referenced as Skinner changed there
> part number several years back. Call John Henry and see.
>
> Regards,
>
> J.R. Wright
> GMC GreatLaker
> 78 Buskirk 30' Stretch
> 1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
> Michigan
>
>
>> Hi All
>> I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was
>> hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace
>> the
>> O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a
>> little
>> while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of
>> O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these
>> successfully?? Is
>> there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size
>> O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
>>
>> Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140449 is a reply to message #140403] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 12:29 |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Jim K's kit may work . I have done the o ring thing many times. I even bought new GM valves when they were availible only to find they also leaked after a short time. I have had J R's expensive valves for a couple of years now. They don't leak.
Roy
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140470 is a reply to message #140449] |
Mon, 22 August 2011 15:11 |
idrob
Messages: 645
Registered: January 2005
Location: Central Idaho
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| roy1 wrote on Mon, 22 August 2011 10:29 |
Jim K's kit may work . I have done the o ring thing many times. I even bought new GM valves when they were availible only to find they also leaked after a short time. I have had J R's expensive valves for a couple of years now. They don't leak.
Roy
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And JR's valves are not much more expensive than two original type valves. Check out the prices and compare. I too tried to repair my original ones only to find they still leaked internally even with good gaskets and new O rings. I am sure Jim K's kit is a good one, but the basic valve design is not. I understand the latest iteration of the valves is better than the earlier one as far as repair ability goes, but still no prize. The early pot metal ones on the 73 and 74's were just crap.
My recommendation is to don't fight it, go with a JR set, and save your time for other things.
Rob Allen
former owner of '76 x-PB
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 [message #140592 is a reply to message #140403] |
Tue, 23 August 2011 07:20 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| Tangerine wrote on Mon, 22 August 2011 09:07 |
Hi All
I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace the O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a little while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these successfully?? Is there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
. ___________
./_][__][] []| 1974 GMC M/H
.*O-------OO-* Painted Desert
"Tangerine Dream" W/New Frame
|
Gary,
Why didn't you bring this up while we were standing in the parking lot Saturday?
I did successfully repair my suspension valves about three years ago.
You have two choices for O-rings, you can buy the kit from JimK, or you can get the correct size from: Detroit Ball Bearings, Bear Service or Zatkoff. You will probably need samples to get the correct size. I did buy some, but I do not recalled which of the three was the supplier (Sorry).
When you dis assemble the valves, keep the valve halves and gaskets together and - if you plan to reuse them - be careful to put the gaskets back in the way they came out. This is important as they have been pre-formed in your favor.
The gaskets are either cork (a poor choice for air) and very fragile or a heavy paper (stronger, but coated with something that flakes off). If the cork survives disassembly, it will work. Both materials can be cleaned with brake parts cleaner (but be very gentle with the cork). At re-assembly, apply a thin coating of teflon pipe thread sealant to make the surface microseal work. It will be almost impossible to coat the gasket, but you can just as easily spread it on the casting edges. This will also help to control the gasket during re-assembly. For this I suggest Loctite 565 also marketed as Permatex 56521, it is not cheap (like 10+$us for a little tube), but that will be a several years supply for every thread that needs sealing for quite a few years.
When you get the O-rings, clean/coat them with Armorall, this will clean the mold release of the surface and lubricate the O-rings so they slide and slip where they really need to be to work effectively.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 - Revision [message #140607 is a reply to message #140592] |
Tue, 23 August 2011 09:04 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| mcolie wrote on Tue, 23 August 2011 08:20 |
| Tangerine wrote on Mon, 22 August 2011 09:07 |
Hi All
I can not afford the upgraded valves for the suspension valves. I was hoping that I could rebuild the old ones. I have tried to replace the O-rings, but they are not quit the right size. They work for a little while and then they blow off the needle/shuttle. There are 2 sizes of O-rings in each valve. Has anyone ever rebuilt these successfully?? Is there a kit out there with the right parts?? What is the right size O-rings to use?? I need both sizes.
Gary W. Mills (Livonia MI)
. ___________
./_][__][] []| 1974 GMC M/H
.*O-------OO-* Painted Desert
"Tangerine Dream" W/New Frame
|
Gary,
Why didn't you bring this up while we were standing in the parking lot Saturday?
I did successfully repair my suspension valves about three years ago.
--You have two choices for O-rings, you can buy the kit from JimK, or you can get the correct size from: Detroit Ball Bearings, Bear Service or Zatkoff.-- You will probably need samples to get the correct size. I did buy some, but I do not recalled which of the three was the supplier (Sorry).
When you dis assemble the valves, keep the valve halves and gaskets together and - if you plan to reuse them - be careful to put the gaskets back in the way they came out. This is important as they have been pre-formed in your favor.
The gaskets are either cork (a poor choice for air) and very fragile or a heavy paper (stronger, but coated with something that flakes off). If the cork survives disassembly, it will work. Both materials can be cleaned with brake parts cleaner (but be very gentle with the cork). At re-assembly, apply a thin coating of teflon pipe thread sealant to make the surface microseal work. It will be almost impossible to coat the gasket, but you can just as easily spread it on the casting edges. This will also help to control the gasket during re-assembly. For this I suggest Loctite 565 also marketed as Permatex 56521, it is not cheap (like 10+$us for a little tube), but that will be a several years supply for every thread that needs sealing for quite a few years.
When you get the O-rings, clean/coat them with Armorall, this will clean the mold release of the surface and lubricate the O-rings so they slide and slip where they really need to be to work effectively.
Matt
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It was pointed out that the wording here was unfortunate.
You have two choices for O-rings, you can buy the kit from JimK (with the right parts), or you can get the correct sizes from: Detroit Ball Bearings, Bearing Service or Zatkoff.
I have never gotten, parts from JimK that were not the correct parts.
Matt (I was never an English major - or any rank for that matter.)
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Suspension Valves in Dash type 1 - Revision [message #140612 is a reply to message #140607] |
Tue, 23 August 2011 09:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Matt,
I reckan for an engenier you spel perty gud! ;-)
Regards,
Rob M.
-----Original Message-----
From: Matt Colie
It was pointed out that the wording here was unfortunate.
You have two choices for O-rings, you can buy the kit from JimK (with the right parts), or you can get the correct sizes from:
Detroit Ball Bearings, Bearing Service or Zatkoff.
I have never gotten, parts from JimK that were not the correct parts.
Matt (I was never an English major - or any rank for that matter.)
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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