Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Coach wont take in Duracool
| Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134852] |
Sat, 16 July 2011 17:16  |
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RF_Burns
Messages: 2277
Registered: June 2008
Location: S. Ontario, Canada
Karma: 3
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So I got the remain bit of 134 removed my my AC system. I read up on the instructions and proceeded to try to refill with Duracool.
Connected the gauge to the low side and stated the engine with the AC on MAX.
Screwed on the can and inverted it and turned in the knob to puncture the can. The gauge went upto 60+ as expected then climbed to 100! and nothing was happening. The compressor was not engaging so I tried bypassing the switches. Sometiimes it will come on for a second or so.
The gauge just stays at 100psi. Nothingis being transfered.
I closed the valve on the can and pulled off the hose set, gauge still at 100psi.
My coach had a 134 adaptor, so I tried changing it to the new one in the kit... no difference.
Its like there is a one way valve holding it in at the coupler
What am I doing wrong?
Thanks
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134871 is a reply to message #134852] |
Sat, 16 July 2011 21:29  |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Can Duracool go into a 134a converted system? I thought it was compatible with R12 oil. Maybe it's good it wouldn't go in until you flush and have the correct oil???? Emmmmmerrrry? I could be wrong.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134872 is a reply to message #134854] |
Sat, 16 July 2011 21:39 |
John Sharpe
Messages: 489
Registered: February 2006
Location: Texas
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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| Quote: |
So I got the remain bit of 134 removed my my AC system. I read up on the instructions and proceeded to try to refill with Duracool.
Connected the gauge to the low side and stated the engine with the AC on MAX.
Screwed on the can and inverted it and turned in the knob to puncture the can. The gauge went up to 60+ as expected then climbed to 100! and nothing was happening. The compressor was not engaging so I tried bypassing the switches. Sometimes it will come on for a second or so.
The gauge just stays at 100psi. Nothing is being transferred.
I closed the valve on the can and pulled off the hose set, gauge still at 100psi.
My coach had a 134 adapter, so I tried changing it to the new one in the kit... no difference.
Its like there is a one way valve holding it in at the coupler
What am I doing wrong?
Thanks
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Could be your gauges. The anti-blow-back valve can stop the flow. This has happen to me on two sets of Harbor Freight gauges. Sometimes they work and sometimes they don't.
| Quote: |
Can Duracool go into a 134a converted system? I thought it was compatible with R12 oil.
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Yes. It is compatible with all oils. Just don't mix them. Well, some of them can be mixed but you have to know which ones so the best statement is "DON'T MIX THE OILS"
John Sharpe
Humble,TX
'78 Eleganza TBI
'89 Spectrum 2000 MPI V-10
'40 Ford Panel Delivery TPI
johnasharpe@gmail.com
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134879 is a reply to message #134852] |
Sat, 16 July 2011 22:27 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Bruce, are you opening the valve on the gauge set? It sounds like you punctured the can with the first valve and then opened it but failed to open the second valve on the side of the gauge that corresponds to the low side. DO NOT OPEN the valve for the high side.
Also the jumper, though not your problem right now, is not installed correctly. If it was, the compressor would run continuously. You do not need the compressor running to get the first can of Duracool into the system. After that it will be very hard to get the others to flow without the compressor running.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134900 is a reply to message #134878] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 07:43 |
John Sharpe
Messages: 489
Registered: February 2006
Location: Texas
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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| Quote: |
Sorry, John. You are wrong.
Duracool is compatible with both mineral oil (R12) and ester oil
(R134a) so you can put iron either system without flushing or
modifications.
Emery Stora
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Emery, that's what I said.| Quote: |
"Yes. It is compatible with all oils. Just don't mix them. Well, some of them can be mixed but you have to know which ones so the best statement is "DON'T MIX THE OILS"
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John Sharpe
Humble,TX
'78 Eleganza TBI
'89 Spectrum 2000 MPI V-10
'40 Ford Panel Delivery TPI
johnasharpe@gmail.com
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134903 is a reply to message #134902] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 08:09 |
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RF_Burns
Messages: 2277
Registered: June 2008
Location: S. Ontario, Canada
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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Opps, forgot the url to the uTube video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2ESleWa1nI
| Quote: |
I'm not sure where this second valve is on the gauge set that you speak of. The only valve I see is the one on the can connector.
My gauge set is exactly the one shown in this uTube video. And I did it exactly as shown in the video.
I can pull the gauge set off the AC coupling and the gauge still sat at about 100psi, so there must be a check valve.
I loosened the gauge a bit to let off the pressure in gauge assembly the with the can valve closed to see if I could figure out is there was check valve stuck in the coupler, but I could not see how it worked. I can't tell where the fluid flows through, the center pin that presses against the schrader valve is fixed to a solid disk in the coupling.
Bruce Hislop,
S. Ontario Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI and ESC.
Hubler front end installed and WOW! !Smile
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
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Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134935 is a reply to message #134933] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 13:09 |
John Sharpe
Messages: 489
Registered: February 2006
Location: Texas
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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| Quote: |
...I'm not sure where this second valve is on the gauge set that you speak of.....
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The gauge set in the video is not the Harbor Freight set I was referring to.
Sorry Emery, Billy Massey pointed that out to me also. I guess it's like to hooker said, 'Just too many Johns.' LOL!!
John Sharpe
Humble,TX
'78 Eleganza TBI
'89 Spectrum 2000 MPI V-10
'40 Ford Panel Delivery TPI
johnasharpe@gmail.com
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134944 is a reply to message #134933] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 15:56 |
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JShot
Messages: 485
Registered: October 2006
Location: NW Ohio
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| RF_Burns wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 13:26 |
I also should install a shut-off on the heater core. Can anyone tell me which side of the heater core is the supply (hot) side? there are two different sized hoses (3/4" and 5/8")
thanks
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Bruce, the 5/8" hose is the supply, but it really doesn't matter. If you install a ball valve in either line, it will positively stop the flow of coolant through the hearer core.
I just did my install of DC today, also. I, like you, must have not had the system totally 'purged'. I put in one can, ran the engine at 1500 for a couple of minutes, and the pressure stabilized at about 24#. But mama says it's blowing cold, so that's good enough for me!
John
John Shotwell
Ridgeville Corners, OH
78 Royale Center Kitchen
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134961 is a reply to message #134903] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 20:52 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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| RF_Burns wrote on Sun, 17 July 2011 08:09 |
Opps, forgot the url to the uTube video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2ESleWa1nI
| Quote: |
I'm not sure where this second valve is on the gauge set that you speak of. The only valve I see is the one on the can connector.
My gauge set is exactly the one shown in this uTube video. And I did it exactly as shown in the video.
I can pull the gauge set off the AC coupling and the gauge still sat at about 100psi, so there must be a check valve.
I loosened the gauge a bit to let off the pressure in gauge assembly the with the can valve closed to see if I could figure out is there was check valve stuck in the coupler, but I could not see how it worked. I can't tell where the fluid flows through, the center pin that presses against the schrader valve is fixed to a solid disk in the coupling.
Bruce Hislop,
S. Ontario Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI and ESC.
Hubler front end installed and WOW! !Smile
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
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Sorry for the confusion. I thought you were using a standard set of gauges that has a pair of gauges and aa pair of valves. I did not realize you were using one built into a can tapper. My mistake.
Walmart has a nice one of those gauges built into a can tapper. It has a trigger on it. You squeeze the trigger to make the coolant flow from the can and let go of the trigger to read the pressure in the system. I do not have a picture of it or the SKU number but is costs about $17.00. It is near the R-134 in the automotive department. A Duracool or a R-134 can will screw right on to it.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134976 is a reply to message #134852] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 22:03 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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Thanks Emery. So that clears it up that HC12 can go in on top of either R12 or 134a, just with the appropriate oil. However am I correct that the "best" way is to properly recover the existing refrigerant by proper protocall and then evac and add HC12, as once you blend, you can't recover.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: Coach wont take in Duracool [message #134982 is a reply to message #134976] |
Sun, 17 July 2011 22:32 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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If you have recovered the old stuff then there is no need to apply a vacuum. Just put in the new Duracool. It is best to not mix refrigerants. You will get better cooling at lower pressures with straight Duracool.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Coach wont take in Duracool [message #135165 is a reply to message #134976] |
Tue, 19 July 2011 10:40 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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On Jul 17, 2011, at 9:03 PM, John R. Lebetski wrote:
>
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> Thanks Emery. So that clears it up that HC12 can go in on top of either R12 or 134a, just with the appropriate oil. However am I correct that the "best" way is to properly recover the existing refrigerant by proper protocall and then evac and add HC12, as once you blend, you can't recover.
> --
> John Lebetski
> Chicago, IL
> 77 Eleganza II
John
That is all correct. Shops will not work on it with a blend in it as they don't have recovery tanks to take blends. In fact, shops won't work on it with Duracool as they only have recovery tanks for R12 and R134a.
The same goes for other blends such as Freeze12 (which is mainly R134a).
With Duracool HC1wa (propane and isobutane blend) there are no regulations about an individual venting it to the air as they are not ozone producing substances.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Santa Fe, NM
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| Re: [GMCnet] Coach wont take in Duracool [message #135177 is a reply to message #135165] |
Tue, 19 July 2011 11:53 |
A Hamilto
Messages: 4508
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 39
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Senior Member |
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| emerystora wrote on Tue, 19 July 2011 10:40 |
With Duracool HC1wa (propane and isobutane blend) there are no regulations about an individual venting it to the air as they are not ozone producing substances.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Santa Fe, NM
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It might be outdated, but according to http://www.epa.gov/ozone/snap/refrigerants/hc-12a.html
"Since November 15, 1995, the Clean Air Act has prohibited the venting of any refrigerant during the service, maintenance, repair, or disposal of air conditioning and refrigeration systems. When working on a system containing a hydrocarbon refrigerant such as HC-12aŽ or DURACOOL 12aŽ, the technician must recover the refrigerant into a suitable container and safely dispose of it."
I have toyed with the idea of acquring a bunsen burner or something and enough surgical tubing to place it a long way from the engine compartment to burn the HC refrigerant instead of just venting it.
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