Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Refrigerator Advice (Wanting to get a new one)
| Refrigerator Advice [message #134050] |
Sun, 10 July 2011 14:41  |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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Our coach still has the original Norcold all electric, AC/DC refrigerator. It still functions OK, but is getting kind of tired. It will cool down and keep things frozen in the freezer, but it takes a long time to do it. It is also getting kind of ratty looking. It is just time to modernize. My wife, Kathy, has wanted a GMC related item for her birthday each of the past few years, and has decided on a refrigerator for this year.
Since we like to dry camp on occasion, we would like to go with a heat absorption fridge and I would like any and all suggestions on brand (Norcold or Dometic), model number, two way or three way, etc. Also, if anyone knows where the best deals are, I would appreciate that information too.
Kathy would also like to know what the comparison is in terms of inside capacity between the old Norcold (7 cf?) and the newer models (6.3 cf).
Thanks everyone.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134076 is a reply to message #134072] |
Sun, 10 July 2011 18:35  |
tphipps
Messages: 3005
Registered: August 2004
Location: Spanish Fort, AL
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Carl, Wrestling with a very similar problem. First, the physical size of your current refrigerator and the hole that it inhabits, will determine the size of a replacement refrigerator. Unless you intend to do some major/minor woodworking to fit a new one, you need to have an measured idea of the physical space and purchase the new one of the same size (external size), that will fit within the same space. Smaller physical size may not matter much, but physically bigger is a PITA. Newer Frigs have better insulation, and you may get more interior frig room for the same exterior physical dimension.
I purchased a new refrigerator from Dometic, based on Dometic's listing of the new refrigerator as an "exact" replacement. Unfortunately, that is not true in 2 out of 3 dimensions. Both Dometic and Norcold list on their web sites the physical dimensions of their new refrigerator. Since I have a brand new Dometic, be aware, when they list the physical depth as 24", you must figure this 24" from top to bottom. Since the GMC body has curves, you must measure the depth from the very top of the refig space to the very bottom of the frig space. Can make for some very strange protrusions into the coach. Avion had to add a 1 3/4 border "trim" to install the Dometic RM66, which appears to be the standard for their coaches. The replacement RM2510 IS NOT an exact fit. And, I am not sure that the smaller one, RM2410 will easily fit there either.
A heat absorption frig will also require an access door, at the bottom of the frig area, to allow for air intake for the propane cycle. You also need an upper vent for air flow up and out of the Frig area. You also need to consider where you will run the propane line to the frig.
The old rule, "Measure twice, cut once," applies to refrigerators also.
It would help if you had listed both your coach interior design and the Norcold Refrigerator model number. Hope this makes sense and helps with the selection.
Tom Phipps, without a frig.
2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552
KA4CSG
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134088 is a reply to message #134072] |
Sun, 10 July 2011 20:33 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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| WD0AFQ wrote on Sun, 10 July 2011 15:11 |
Its about time. No more generator running all day at Quartzsite.
Dan
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Thanks Dan...You're right! That generator can get annoying.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134093 is a reply to message #134076] |
Sun, 10 July 2011 21:03 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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| tphipps wrote on Sun, 10 July 2011 16:35 |
Carl, Wrestling with a very similar problem. First, the physical size of your current refrigerator and the hole that it inhabits, will determine the size of a replacement refrigerator. Unless you intend to do some major/minor woodworking to fit a new one, you need to have an measured idea of the physical space and purchase the new one of the same size (external size), that will fit within the same space. Smaller physical size may not matter much, but physically bigger is a PITA. Newer Frigs have better insulation, and you may get more interior frig room for the same exterior physical dimension.
I purchased a new refrigerator from Dometic, based on Dometic's listing of the new refrigerator as an "exact" replacement. Unfortunately, that is not true in 2 out of 3 dimensions. Both Dometic and Norcold list on their web sites the physical dimensions of their new refrigerator. Since I have a brand new Dometic, be aware, when they list the physical depth as 24", you must figure this 24" from top to bottom. Since the GMC body has curves, you must measure the depth from the very top of the refig space to the very bottom of the frig space. Can make for some very strange protrusions into the coach. Avion had to add a 1 3/4 border "trim" to install the Dometic RM66, which appears to be the standard for their coaches. The replacement RM2510 IS NOT an exact fit. And, I am not sure that the smaller one, RM2410 will easily fit there either.
A heat absorption frig will also require an access door, at the bottom of the frig area, to allow for air intake for the propane cycle. You also need an upper vent for air flow up and out of the Frig area. You also need to consider where you will run the propane line to the frig.
The old rule, "Measure twice, cut once," applies to refrigerators also.
It would help if you had listed both your coach interior design and the Norcold Refrigerator model number. Hope this makes sense and helps with the selection.
Tom Phipps, without a frig.
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Thanks for the reply Tom.
The coach is a 26-2 floor plan with a full time bed in the back. It has the original Norcold in it, listed in the Maintenance Manual as a "seven and one half cubic foot refrigerator". My fridge compartment has a vented access panel in the wall and a vent in the roof. The propane compartment is in the right rear of the coach, so getting propane through the area under the bathroom sink, and above the wheel well will not be an issue.
My choices seem to be either a Norcold or a Dometic 6.3 cubic foot model. These seem to have the dimensions that are closest to the original. What I need help in deciding is whether a specific model or brand will work better in my climate (the desert of Southern Arizona) than another, specifically if there is any advantage to a two way or a three way.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134120 is a reply to message #134118] |
Sun, 10 July 2011 22:52 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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I know, Dan.
What are friends for?
The only dimension I think looks like a problem is the depth. Is it really tight at the top where the coach wall curves in? It should be easy to tee into the propane and run a line to the fridge compartment, other than that, you are correct, it is set up for a propane fridge.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134142 is a reply to message #134120] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 08:21 |
tphipps
Messages: 3005
Registered: August 2004
Location: Spanish Fort, AL
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Carl, I would think that there is not 10 cents worth of difference between the 2 major brands in their operation or cooling capabilities. The heat absorption cycle being what it is, there should not be any physics-related differences between the two. I would go with size of opening, and the features that the wife would like to have in her refrigerator. Wish I had measured my actual opening, before purchase.
You might get one of the solar fans to place high in the air flow of the refrigerator. Keeping the air moving up and out is the goal. I added a small muffin fan to the back area of my previous frig, and it greatly improved the cooling ability of the unit. The fan I used was from a 110v a.c. power supply and could move a lot of air out the top vent. Orientate the fan horizontally to move the air straight up, not aimed at the cooling coils. Did not help on 12v operation, but could have easily been feed by an inverter, not much ampere draw on a small muffin fan. I expect that you could find a bigger 12v fan and do your own thing with the fan. Cheaper than the solar fan sold at CW.
Tom Phipps, No frig yet
2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552
KA4CSG
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| Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice [message #134143 is a reply to message #134050] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 08:42 |
peabody
Messages: 126
Registered: May 2011
Location: steamboat springs, co
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I wish that I could be of more help, however, I have sold my house & my refrigerator records are in storage,. I did buy a Norcold model N 641.3 (in 2004) and I love it. It is a 3 way and works like a charm. I contacted by internet every supplier that I could find for price and settled on a place with the lowest price and free shipping to my mechanics address (not my home address).
Getting the OEM refrigerator out was a SOB! Had to resort to using a saws-all to cut the frame into pieces.
Also my coach was not equipped for a propane refrigerator, so I had to tap into the propane tank, and install side and top vents, and build a "chimney" . All the extra work was well worth having a 3-way refrigerator.
Bill
William S. Schurman
P.O. 773325
Steamboat Springs, CO (Ski Town USA)
at the foot of Rabbit Ears Pass
970-846-4212
'78 Palm Beach TZE 168V100258
'90 SHO
'66 912
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: carljr3b@yahoo.com
> Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2011 14:41:58 -0500
> Subject: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice
>
>
>
> Our coach still has the original Norcold all electric, AC/DC refrigerator. It still functions OK, but is getting kind of tired. It will cool down and keep things frozen in the freezer, but it takes a long time to do it. It is also getting kind of ratty looking. It is just time to modernize. My wife, Kathy, has wanted a GMC related item for her birthday each of the past few years, and has decided on a refrigerator for this year.
>
> Since we like to dry camp on occasion, we would like to go with a heat absorption fridge and I would like any and all suggestions on brand (Norcold or Dometic), model number, two way or three way, etc. Also, if anyone knows where the best deals are, I would appreciate that information too.
>
> Kathy would also like to know what the comparison is in terms of inside capacity between the old Norcold (7 cf?) and the newer models (6.3 cf).
>
> Thanks everyone.
> --
> Carl S.
> '75 ex Palm Beach
> Tucson, AZ.
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134144 is a reply to message #134050] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 08:45 |
kingd
Messages: 592
Registered: June 2004
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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Carl, some things I know and seem to be consensus of others, with a 3 way, the 12V draw is quite high, short battery life with engine off. Advantage is can drive down the road with propane off, like with rhe original fridge. 12v is really only usefull for maintaining temperature in an already cooled fridge. However, a 2 way fridge can be run on 110 V off a correct inverter going down the road. Some people don't like the propane on going down the road, and most places it is illegal to fuel with the propane on/fridge lit. Most new fridges need 12v even when on propane, so battery capacity "could" limit fridge operation.
Just what I think I know
DAVE KING ( with all electric compressor Norcold )
DAVE KING
lurker, wannabe
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
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| Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice [message #134177 is a reply to message #134120] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 11:24 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Carl,
There are several Dometic refrigs that will fit the palm beach coach.
See: <http://www.dometic.com/enus/Americas/USA/RV-Products/refrigerators/
>
The DM 2620 Classic, DM 2652 Americana which we had in the coach we
just sold and it was a good unit and the DM 2662 Americana Plus.
These should clear the coach body without problem and allow for more
than sufficient hot air flow to the roof vent. The newer refrigs of
today are not exactly the same as you will be removing, but the
refinishing of the molding should be minimal in most cases.
The other choice is 2 way or 3 way? JMHO I do not see any value in
purchasing a 3 way unit for the GMC. Unless you have a very large
battery system with solar backup such as a DP SOB, then having the 12
VDC power for running the cooling is not an added cost that you need
to spend. All RV refrigs do require 12 VDC for control power to
operate when not plugged into shore power.
Take a look at these and of course the choice is yours to make.
http://tinyurl.com/6z5mjjg
<http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/rv-refrigerators/americana-fridge-double.htm
>
I was at Camping World yesterday a saw this one on special for just a
little over $1000. Take a run out to the Camping World on Irvington
near the expressway and see what they have.
<http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/dometic-classic-rm2620-2-way-refrigerator-double-door-6-0-cu-ft-/18297
>
Carl, we will again be staying at Rincon Country West, Mid January
thru Mid March. We will have at least 4 GMC's parked together during
that time.
Regards,
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
78 Buskirk 30' Stretch
1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
On Jul 10, 2011, at 11:52 PM, Carl Stouffer wrote:
>
>
> I know, Dan.
>
> What are friends for? :lol:
>
> The only dimension I think looks like a problem is the depth. Is it
> really tight at the top where the coach wall curves in? It should
> be easy to tee into the propane and run a line to the fridge
> compartment, other than that, you are correct, it is set up for a
> propane fridge.
> --
> Carl S.
> '75 ex Palm Beach
> Tucson, AZ.
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice [message #134190 is a reply to message #134177] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 14:38 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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OK, Thanks for all the info so far. The only reason I would think a three way would be desirable would be for being able to turn off the propane while driving, yet keeping the fridge in operation (albeit at a less efficient level). Some have advised just turning the fridge off while under way and others have advised using it in gas mode while driving (we ran the fridges in my father's SOBs that way all the time without a problem)
I don't think it would make sense to run a two way on 120 volt mode, through an inverter, while driving. The spec on these refrigerators says that they will draw 3 amps at 120 volts. If my math is correct, that works out to 360 watts. backing that off to 12 volts DC, through an inverter, it works out to 30 amps! right? The refrigerator will only draw 14.8 amps on 12 volts DC. Am I missing something here, or just having a brain fart? Electricity is not my strong suite.
I guess my next step is to decide who to order one from. PPL Motorhomes seems to have the best price, but (as I do with the GMC suppliers) I have a desire to support my local RV supply store too. I'll have to think about that for a while.
Thanks again. Any more thoughts?
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice [message #134193 is a reply to message #134190] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 15:13 |
Terry Lytle
Messages: 16
Registered: April 2008
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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Carl When i changed my fridge i did not like how small a fridge i would have in a 2/3 way . Ended up with a 12 volt model Draws 6 amp when condencer is running put a little extra insulation around it
Works good have 2solar panels and can leave it on weeks at a time Just put in fresh BEER and cold steaks and go during camping season leave all perishables in it usualy unplugged Freezer is on bottom i think it is 9cu feet have to keep it turned down or BEER will freeze
Terry Lytle
----- Original Message -----
From: Carl Stouffer <carljr3b@yahoo.com>
Date: Monday, July 11, 2011 1:38 pm
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>
>
> OK, Thanks for all the info so far. The only reason I
> would think a three way would be desirable would be for being
> able to turn off the propane while driving, yet keeping the
> fridge in operation (albeit at a less efficient level).
> Some have advised just turning the fridge off while under way
> and others have advised using it in gas mode while driving (we
> ran the fridges in my father's SOBs that way all the time
> without a problem)
>
> I don't think it would make sense to run a two way on 120 volt
> mode, through an inverter, while driving. The spec on
> these refrigerators says that they will draw 3 amps at 120
> volts. If my math is correct, that works out to 360
> watts. backing that off to 12 volts DC, through an
> inverter, it works out to 30 amps! right? The refrigerator
> will only draw 14.8 amps on 12 volts DC. Am I missing
> something here, or just having a brain fart? Electricity
> is not my strong suite.
>
> I guess my next step is to decide who to order one from.
> PPL Motorhomes seems to have the best price, but (as I do with
> the GMC suppliers) I have a desire to support my local RV supply
> store too. I'll have to think about that for a while.
>
> Thanks again. Any more thoughts?
> --
> Carl S.
> '75 ex Palm Beach
> Tucson, AZ.
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice [message #134199 is a reply to message #134193] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 16:51 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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| Terry Lytle wrote on Mon, 11 July 2011 13:13 |
Carl When i changed my fridge i did not like how small a fridge i would have in a 2/3 way . Ended up with a 12 volt model Draws 6 amp when condencer is running put a little extra insulation around it
Works good have 2solar panels and can leave it on weeks at a time Just put in fresh BEER and cold steaks and go during camping season leave all perishables in it usualy unplugged Freezer is on bottom i think it is 9cu feet have to keep it turned down or BEER will freeze
Terry Lytle
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Thanks Terry,
I have been doing the electric thing for three years now and am ready to go with the more dry-camping friendly propane fridge. I also want to stay with a fridge that will fit in the original hole. It seems that a 6.3 cf unit is the way to go.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134207 is a reply to message #134201] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 17:51 |
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Terry, tha nova kook unit looks great but ouch on the price! How many DC amps does it pull?
| Terry Lytle wrote on Mon, 11 July 2011 17:16 |
Thats what i am saying 9.1cu fits where 6.3cu absortion fits or original i only dry camp and have gotten rid of onan ido have 2 90 watt solar panels i never plug in even when home ijust leave fridge run check out there web site NOVA KOOL i am sure there are others as well i have a 76 pb
Terry
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73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
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| Re: Refrigerator Advice [message #134229 is a reply to message #134201] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 20:33 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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| Terry Lytle wrote on Mon, 11 July 2011 15:16 |
Thats what i am saying 9.1cu fits where 6.3cu absortion fits or original i only dry camp and have gotten rid of onan ido have 2 90 watt solar panels i never plug in even when home ijust leave fridge run check out there web site NOVA KOOL i am sure there are others as well i have a 76 pb
Terry
|
Hard to believe that it has that much more interior space and it fits in the same cut-out, but apparently true. I think the 6.3 cf absorption fridge will be fine for our purposes (I'm not a beer drinker  ). Plus it will fit into my budget better. I plan on upgrading to solar at some point, but not enough to keep up with an electric refrigerator.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: [GMCnet] Refrigerator Advice [message #134245 is a reply to message #134190] |
Mon, 11 July 2011 21:18 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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On some of the 3 way refrigerators, there is a gas burner , a 120 volt
resistance heater, and a 12 Volt resistance heater. The 12 V heater is
quite a bit smaller than the 120 volt and uses less current when it is in
operation. The one in my 78 Royale only works on 12 volt when the engine
runs, and is powered by a relay that closes when the primary side is
energized by the alternator circuit. It will keep up with an already cold
refrigerator, but has a difficult time bringing the box to the proper temp
when starting out. I guess the thinking is, either start with the propane or
120 Volt and then when you are traveling, the 12 Volt will keep up with it,
which it does. It works for me as I rarely dry camp and when I do the
propane works very well. JWID.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 12:38 PM, Carl Stouffer <carljr3b@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> OK, Thanks for all the info so far. The only reason I would think a three
> way would be desirable would be for being able to turn off the propane while
> driving, yet keeping the fridge in operation (albeit at a less efficient
> level). Some have advised just turning the fridge off while under way and
> others have advised using it in gas mode while driving (we ran the fridges
> in my father's SOBs that way all the time without a problem)
>
> I don't think it would make sense to run a two way on 120 volt mode,
> through an inverter, while driving. The spec on these refrigerators says
> that they will draw 3 amps at 120 volts. If my math is correct, that works
> out to 360 watts. backing that off to 12 volts DC, through an inverter, it
> works out to 30 amps! right? The refrigerator will only draw 14.8 amps on
> 12 volts DC. Am I missing something here, or just having a brain fart?
> Electricity is not my strong suite.
>
> I guess my next step is to decide who to order one from. PPL Motorhomes
> seems to have the best price, but (as I do with the GMC suppliers) I have a
> desire to support my local RV supply store too. I'll have to think about
> that for a while.
>
> Thanks again. Any more thoughts?
> --
> Carl S.
> '75 ex Palm Beach
> Tucson, AZ.
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
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