Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Really Wet Floors (Hunting for a massive leak cant be hard, right?)
| Really Wet Floors [message #111466] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 17:38  |
waynefraser
Messages: 38
Registered: December 2010
Location: Delta, BC
Karma: 0
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Hi All - I could use some help on this.... I am a brand new GMC owner and I just came back from a 3000 mile trip in my "new" '73. Family had a great time and the coach ran very well.(Many thanks to Jim K and the gang at Applied for their outstanding service when we stopped by for some upgrades). Here's the problem: We experienced some extensive downpours along the way and found the carpeted floors flooded. Lots of water coming in should be easy to spot, right? As far as i can tell, no water came from overhead or from the windows (I had the roof and windows professionally sealed prior to the trip)Strangely nothing above the lower floor carpet was wet. Some data points: no rusted ceiling screws or discoloration/evidence of roof water leakage. My fresh water tank was empty for most of the trip, the flood water seemed to colorless, and affected the isle and drivers side from bedroom to where the cockpit stairs begin. I have had it outside in the rain and it doesnt seem to leak while standing still. Any suggestions as to where to look for this seemingly massive leak? (just my newbie opinion..I susepct its road water coming up through the wheel wells) Many thanks for any help on this. Cheers
Wayne Fraser,
1973 Glacier 260,
Ladner, BC
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111467 is a reply to message #111466] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 17:50  |
g.winger
Messages: 792
Registered: February 2008
Location: Warrenton,Missouri
Karma: 0
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Can't help on the leaks. But do tell,,,,don't leave us in suspense. What upgrades did you make and whe're the photos.(ya,,,I know.I've yet to post some pics. Hopeing to learn how to "resize"),,,,,PL
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111470 is a reply to message #111466] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 18:13 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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| waynefraser wrote on Sun, 09 January 2011 15:38 |
Hi All - I could use some help on this.... I am a brand new GMC owner and I just came back from a 3000 mile trip in my "new" '73. Family had a great time and the coach ran very well.(Many thanks to Jim K and the gang at Applied for their outstanding service when we stopped by for some upgrades). Here's the problem: We experienced some extensive downpours along the way and found the carpeted floors flooded. Lots of water coming in should be easy to spot, right? As far as i can tell, no water came from overhead or from the windows (I had the roof and windows professionally sealed prior to the trip)Strangely nothing above the lower floor carpet was wet. Some data points: no rusted ceiling screws or discoloration/evidence of roof water leakage. My fresh water tank was empty for most of the trip, the flood water seemed to colorless, and affected the isle and drivers side from bedroom to where the cockpit stairs begin. I have had it outside in the rain and it doesnt seem to leak while standing still. Any suggestions as to where to look for this seemingly massive leak? (just my newbie opinion..I susepct its road water coming up through the wheel wells) Many thanks for any help on this. Cheers
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Wayne,
It was good to meet you at JimKs a few weeks ago.
If it is from the front wheel wells, I would look under the couch and under the dinette seat (or what ever is behind the front wheels.
In the rear, you can sort of reach down between the wheel well and the vanity in the bathroom. Perhaps you, or one of your kids could feel down in there... open the slider against the back wall by the toilet.
Did you hook up to city water at any time? We had a great leak in the wall in the closet. The PO unhooked the pipe from the city water inlet to the coach system so water just ran down the wall... that was real nice. Water was everywhere.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111473 is a reply to message #111466] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 18:30 |
jknezek
Messages: 1057
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 5
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I can sympathize with this one. I have an odd leak that sometimes appears when hooked to city water. It makes the carpet wet between the bathroom and the closet. I took the closet pieces out and it was completely dry back there. I also checked all down the bath side and it's completely dry back there. I can climb under the coach and don't hear any pressurized leaks from below. Totally baffled by this one. Seems to happen even if I have a pressure regulator on the line. Usually I just use the water tank these days since I can't figure it out.
Thanks,
Jeremy Knezek
1976 Glenbrook
Birmingham, AL
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111474 is a reply to message #111466] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 18:47 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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If the water is on the floor in the rear between the closet and the bath module, and it only comes in when it is raining and you are driving.....Then your problem is probably the seam of the floor picking up water from the wheel wells. If you look inside the wheel rear wheels wells you can see the edge of the horizontal piece of plywood that makes up the floor. Unfortunatelt the wheel wells are about 1.5 inches too short to cover up the plywood edge. You need to seal this edge with something. I suggest undercoating it and if you desire, making about about a 2" deflector strip and attaching full length to the bottom of the wheel well plastic.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Really Wet Floors [message #111475 is a reply to message #111473] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 18:49 |
Charles
Messages: 455
Registered: January 2004
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Jeremy,
A common problem on the city water hook-up is just
inside the hose connection valve on the inside of the coach.
Were you able to see the inside, side of this valve when you
had the panel out of the closet?. Were you hooked up to
city water when you had the closet panel out. I have replaced
the hose connection on my coach twice in 10 years. I think
just enough water stayed in it and froze to brake mine both
times.
Charles
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Charles Wersal
Duncanville, Texas
26 foot 1975 Glenbrook
Pandora's Box
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| Re: [GMCnet] Really Wet Floors [message #111480 is a reply to message #111475] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 19:25 |
jknezek
Messages: 1057
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 5
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| Charles wrote on Sun, 09 January 2011 19:49 |
Jeremy,
A common problem on the city water hook-up is just
inside the hose connection valve on the inside of the coach.
Were you able to see the inside, side of this valve when you
had the panel out of the closet?. Were you hooked up to
city water when you had the closet panel out. I have replaced
the hose connection on my coach twice in 10 years. I think
just enough water stayed in it and froze to brake mine both
times.
Charles
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I'm not sure if I actually saw the area you are mentioning. However, the inside of the coach behind the closet was bone dry while I was hooked up to city water. Still, it is an area to double check this spring. Thanks.
Thanks,
Jeremy Knezek
1976 Glenbrook
Birmingham, AL
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111484 is a reply to message #111474] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 20:04 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
Karma: 0
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| Ken Burton wrote on Sun, 09 January 2011 16:47 |
If the water is on the floor in the rear between the closet and the bath module, and it only comes in when it is raining and you are driving.....Then your problem is probably the seam of the floor picking up water from the wheel wells. If you look inside the wheel rear wheels wells you can see the edge of the horizontal piece of plywood that makes up the floor. ...
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My '73 had this problem. Took me a while but I finally spotted the problem. But before I could fix it "properly," we needed to take a quick trip (death in the family) during the cold and rainy season. Only having a day to get ready, I wiped the dirt off the seams and sprayed a can of "great stuff" foam into every seam I could find. (I also had cold air leaks around the sides of the firewall, so I sprayed there too.) After the foam dried, I sprayed black paint over it. Worked fine. I didn't expect it to hold, but it has.
JWID (Just what I Did)
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111485 is a reply to message #111484] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 20:15 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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I should have mentioned that this is not my original idea. I got it from Gene Dotson.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Really Wet Floors [message #111502 is a reply to message #111466] |
Sun, 09 January 2011 23:56 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Wayne,
I think your "road water" suspicion is correct: Check the joint
between the lower cockpit step riser and the outer skin of the coach.
You'll be able to access that area better from the outside if you
remove the wheel well liners, but you can see up behind those liners a
little for a preliminary check. The vertical crack there should be
cleaned out as well as you can and sealed with caulk, mastic, or
"Great Stuff".
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI+ & EBL
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 6:38 PM, Wayne <waynefraser@telus.net> wrote:
>
... the flood water seemed to colorless, and affected the isle and
drivers side from bedroom to where the cockpit stairs begin. I have
had it outside in the rain and it doesnt seem to leak while standing
still. Any suggestions as to where to look for this seemingly massive
leak? (just my newbie opinion..I susepct its road water coming up
through the wheel wells) Many thanks for any help on this. Cheers
> _______________________________________________
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GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111504 is a reply to message #111466] |
Mon, 10 January 2011 02:25 |
waynefraser
Messages: 38
Registered: December 2010
Location: Delta, BC
Karma: 0
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Many thanks Everyone for your suggestions. I gently took apart the closet interior and inspected the topside of the wheel well and the city water filler. (Water filler connections looked new but will presure test to tomorrow). What caught my attention was a handfull of soggy mess of mud and rotted wood at the rear-most edge of where the wheel well meets the wood seam that Ken B described (at the point where the floor,outside wall, and wheel well all meet). I will let you know what i find when its cleaned up and the situaltion is more visible. I have removed all the floor carpet, underlay, and tack strips to aid the drying process. Generally, the floor looks wet but pretty solid. I will inspect the other 3 wheel wells next. Cheers!
Wayne Fraser,
1973 Glacier 260,
Ladner, BC
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111541 is a reply to message #111528] |
Mon, 10 January 2011 12:16 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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| waynefraser wrote on Mon, 10 January 2011 07:25 |
Hi George
It was great to meet you at Applied and I hope we continue to communicate. I am pleased to mention that my wife took the wheel of the GMC when driving back through San Francisco and is now officially the only one in the family to drive the Golden Gate Bridge!
Cheers!
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Wayne,
Glad your wife did some driving. Maybe in the future she can take the "Ladies, Drive that GMC" course at a GMCMI rally. Ruth came back very confident... As I said, she even backed through the slalom of cones. I was pretty proud of her.
Good luck on the soggy places. You have received advice from some of the most experienced.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #111633 is a reply to message #111504] |
Mon, 10 January 2011 22:58 |
Adrien G.
Messages: 474
Registered: May 2008
Location: Burns Flat, OK 73624
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Wayne,
Hi, In my rebuilding if the inside I found a lot of dirt in the back end (dried mud). With the closet out I that the wheel buckets (wheel house/cover) where riveted on top and bottom, not front and back, and the wall is curved but the bucket front/back lip are straight. I saw the OEM sponge rubber filler was about gone, most of the rivets where either broken or not in to the wall, one bucket had only 2 rivets holding. Check for cracked/split buckets.
Put a light in the back of the bucket and from the outside you'll see the gap where the tire slings the water in.
My gen and LP box where the same way-open to the outside.
On the front the step to floor on each wall had large gaps, and at the cockpit gap between wall and floor below driver & pass windows.
These coaches where to last only 10 to 15 years, GM estimate.
Hope this will help in your solution.
Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
75 Glenbrook (26-3) Mods LS3.70 FD / Reaction Sys / 80mm Front&Intermidiate / Hydroboost / 16" Tires / Frame Rebuild / Interior Rebuild
Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
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| Re: [GMCnet] Really Wet Floors [message #111637 is a reply to message #111633] |
Mon, 10 January 2011 23:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Adrien,
I spotted the same thing in the front wheel wells when I got back to Houston
this summer.
Sealing those gaps are on my TTD list for next summer and I will also check
the rears.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Adrien Genesoto
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2011 3:58 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Really Wet Floors
Wayne,
Hi, In my rebuilding if the inside I found a lot of dirt in the back end
(dried mud). With the closet out I that the wheel buckets (wheel
house/cover) where riveted on top and bottom, not front and back, and the
wall is curved but the bucket front/back lip are straight. I saw the OEM
sponge rubber filler was about gone, most of the rivets where either broken
or not in to the wall, one bucket had only 2 rivets holding. Check for
cracked/split buckets.
Put a light in the back of the bucket and from the outside you'll see the
gap where the tire slings the water in.
My gen and LP box where the same way-open to the outside.
On the front the step to floor on each wall had large gaps, and at the
cockpit gap between wall and floor below driver & pass windows.
These coaches where to last only 10 to 15 years, GM estimate.
Hope this will help in your solution.
--
Adrien
75 Glenbrook
Yuba City,Ca.
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List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: Really Wet Floors [message #112868 is a reply to message #112856] |
Mon, 24 January 2011 00:21 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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Senior Member |
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| waynefraser wrote on Sun, 23 January 2011 21:00 |
Hi All... Just posted some pictures of what i found last week. As others ave mentioned, the plywood seam runs right at the point where the wheel well meets the floor. This had almost rotted out the edge of the rear-most floor panel. I dried it out and and applied git-rot to the rotted floor. Next step is to seal the area.
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Glad you found it. Now you can get it fixed and start enjoying a dry GMC. Most of us have had a "water incident". All part of the fun once you figure out where it is coming from,
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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