Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Another disappointment with a supplier
| Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106177] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 06:17  |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Yes, that is the wrong stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from leaking.
I looked up and brought in the gasket. The McCord (now Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. So, I opted for Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material pre-compressed locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan edge. For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had difficulty maintaining this feature in spec. This vent is kind of important so lube will not get forced out through joints and seals. The supplied part will have no issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of yours.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106180 is a reply to message #106177] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 07:34  |
GMC_LES
Messages: 569
Registered: October 2009
Location: Montreal
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Matt,
I am interpreting your message to read as though the Fel-Pro gasket is
incorrectly vented. If this is so, what are your suggestions to correct the
fault?
Thanks,
Les Burt
________________________________
From: Matt Colie <mcolie@chartermi.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Fri, November 19, 2010 7:17:16 AM
Subject: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier
My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Yes, that is the wrong
stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from leaking.
I looked up and brought in the gasket. The McCord (now
Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. So, I opted for
Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material pre-compressed
locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan edge.
For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had difficulty
maintaining this feature in spec. This vent is kind of important so lube will
not get forced out through joints and seals. The supplied part will have no
issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of yours.
Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie
'73 Glacier 23 Chaumiere (say show-me-air)
SE Michigan - DTW 3.2/4R
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Les Burt
Montreal
1975 Eleganza 26ft
A work in Progress
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106183 is a reply to message #106177] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 08:23 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Matt,
I am making the assumption from what you've written below vis-à-vis how it
vents that you have a 3.07 final drive (the 3.21 uses a different vent
system). If so there is another vent area. The two holes at 12:00 in the
large seal on the side of the final drive that faces away from the oil pan.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Matt Colie
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 6:17 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier
My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Yes, that is the
wrong stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from leaking.
I looked up and brought in the gasket. The McCord (now
Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. So, I opted for
Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material pre-compressed
locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan
edge. For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had
difficulty maintaining this feature in spec. This vent is kind of important
so lube will not get forced out through joints and seals. The supplied part
will have no issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of
yours.
Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie
'73 Glacier 23 Chaumiere (say show-me-air)
SE Michigan - DTW 3.2/4R
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106191 is a reply to message #106177] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 10:16 |
Luvn737s
Messages: 1106
Registered: June 2007
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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I've had nothing but good luck with the semi-aerosol Right Stuff sealant. I guess you could try sealing up something non-auto related first to prove it to yourself, but I have been amazed at how well it works.
Randy
1973 26' Painted Desert
Ahwatukee (Phoenix) AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106198 is a reply to message #106183] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 11:18 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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All,
Some of the Felpro gaskets for the final drive that I have bought in the last several years have been assembled incorrectly. The venting holes do not line up correctly. It is just a matter of taking the staples out swapping the order so they align on the cover vent holes. The gasket with vent path should be to the cover side and the uncut gasket to the drive side. Both of my final drive also have a metal vent cover tab that fits on the outside of the cover and is held on by the adjacent bolts. Just what I have seen in the last few years.
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
TZE Zone Restorations
77 Eleganza Custom (For Sale)
1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
> Matt,
>
> I am making the assumption from what you've written below vis-à-vis how it
> vents that you have a 3.07 final drive (the 3.21 uses a different vent
> system). If so there is another vent area. The two holes at 12:00 in the
> large seal on the side of the final drive that faces away from the oil pan.
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> USAussie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Matt Colie
> Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 6:17 AM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier
>
>
>
> My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Yes, that is the
> wrong stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from leaking.
>
>
> I looked up and brought in the gasket. The McCord (now
> Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. So, I opted for
> Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
>
> The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material pre-compressed
> locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan
> edge. For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had
> difficulty maintaining this feature in spec. This vent is kind of important
> so lube will not get forced out through joints and seals. The supplied part
> will have no issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
>
> So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of
> yours.
>
> Matt
> --
> Matt & Mary Colie
> '73 Glacier 23 Chaumiere (say show-me-air)
> SE Michigan - DTW 3.2/4R
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106202 is a reply to message #106180] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 12:06 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| Les Burt wrote on Fri, 19 November 2010 08:34 |
Matt,
I am interpreting your message to read as though the Fel-Pro gasket is incorrectly vented. If this is so, what are your suggestions to correct the fault?
Thanks,
Les Burt
________________________________
From: Matt Colie
My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Yes, that is the wrong stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from leaking.
I looked up and brought in the gasket. The McCord (now Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. So, I opted for Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material pre-compressed locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan edge.
For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had difficulty maintaining this feature in spec. This vent is kind of important so lube will not get forced out through joints and seals. The supplied part will have no issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of yours.
Matt
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Les,
My first suggestion is try to locate a part that has the correct features for venting. I don't know who else to try, but I will be looking around in the future.
If I find one, I'll get Bdub to put it in the book.
What I did ?
I very carefully formed a piece if 1/16 welding wire and bashed into the gasket surface in the hope of creating the desired leak.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106204 is a reply to message #106183] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 12:12 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| Robert Mueller wrote on Fri, 19 November 2010 09:23 |
Matt,
I am making the assumption from what you've written below vis-à-vis how it vents that you have a 3.07 final drive (the 3.21 uses a different vent system). If so there is another vent area. The two holes at 12:00 in the large seal on the side of the final drive that faces away from the oil pan.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
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Rob,
Yes, it is a 3.07 and there is still the hole in the pan rail and the cover plate with wings. As the original vent was there, I did not look for another, but I will before the final drive gets lifted in.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106224 is a reply to message #106198] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 15:11 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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J.R. The felpro gasket now supplied as a replacement gasket for the
3:07 final drive is an assembled pair of gaskets that are stapled together.
One gasket that faces the final drive has a labrinth passage that goes from
the gearcase up to the vicinity of the vent hole in the cover. The second
gasket has no passage. There have been some different sheet metal stamped
covers used through the years and the small vent hole is not in the same
place on all of them. Gaskets are furnished without the vent hole punched in
the gasket towards the cover. After the cover and gaskets are assembled with
the labyrinth towards the gearbox, take a drill bit that matches the vent
hole in the cover and holding it in your fingers, gently drill a hole
through the gasket. This allows a channel for the air that expands &
contracts to escape or breathe without loosing any of the lubricant. Just be
sure to put the cover tab on the top bolt when you are finished as this
keeps dirt out of the hole. Hope this helps clarify this issue. I can post
pix if it will help.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 Royale 403
On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 9:18 AM, John Wright <powerjon@chartermi.net> wrote:
> All,
> Some of the Felpro gaskets for the final drive that I have bought in the
> last several years have been assembled incorrectly. The venting holes do
> not line up correctly. It is just a matter of taking the staples out
> swapping the order so they align on the cover vent holes. The gasket with
> vent path should be to the cover side and the uncut gasket to the drive
> side. Both of my final drive also have a metal vent cover tab that fits on
> the outside of the cover and is held on by the adjacent bolts. Just what I
> have seen in the last few years.
>
> J.R. Wright
> GMC GreatLaker
> TZE Zone Restorations
> 77 Eleganza Custom (For Sale)
> 1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
> Michigan
>
> > Matt,
> >
> > I am making the assumption from what you've written below vis-à-vis how
> it
> > vents that you have a 3.07 final drive (the 3.21 uses a different vent
> > system). If so there is another vent area. The two holes at 12:00 in the
> > large seal on the side of the final drive that faces away from the oil
> pan.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Rob M.
> > USAussie
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> > [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Matt Colie
> > Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 6:17 AM
> > To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> > Subject: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier
> >
> >
> >
> > My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Yes, that is the
> > wrong stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from
> leaking.
> >
> >
> > I looked up and brought in the gasket. The McCord (now
> > Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. So, I opted for
> > Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
> >
> > The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material
> pre-compressed
> > locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan
> > edge. For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had
> > difficulty maintaining this feature in spec. This vent is kind of
> important
> > so lube will not get forced out through joints and seals. The supplied
> part
> > will have no issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
> >
> > So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of
> > yours.
> >
> > Matt
> > --
> > Matt & Mary Colie
> > '73 Glacier 23 Chaumiere (say show-me-air)
> > SE Michigan - DTW 3.2/4R
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106258 is a reply to message #106198] |
Fri, 19 November 2010 22:00 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Fel Pro came out with a new one piece gasket. It does not work at all.
I called and told them then or the problem,but will take some time.
We have another brand that will work along with the correct seal for
the left side with 2 small vent holes.
On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 9:18 AM, John Wright <powerjon@chartermi.net> wrote:
> All,
> Some of the Felpro gaskets for the final drive that I have bought in the last several years have been assembled incorrectly.  The venting holes do not line up correctly.  It is just a matter of taking the staples out swapping the order so they align on the cover vent holes.  The gasket with vent path should be to the cover side and the uncut gasket to the drive side.  Both of my final drive  also have a metal vent cover tab that fits on the outside of the cover and is held on by the adjacent bolts.  Just what I have seen in the last few years.
>
> J.R. Wright
> GMC GreatLaker
> TZE Zone Restorations
> 77 Eleganza Custom (For Sale)
> 1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
> Michigan
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> I am making the assumption from what you've written below vis-Ã -vis how it
>> vents that you have a 3.07 final drive (the 3.21 uses a different vent
>> system). If so there is another vent area. The two holes at 12:00 in the
>> large seal on the side of the final drive that faces away from the oil pan.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Rob M.
>> USAussie
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
>> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Matt Colie
>> Sent: Friday, November 19, 2010 6:17 AM
>> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>> Subject: [GMCnet] Another disappointment with a supplier
>>
>>
>>
>> My final drive was closed up with high temp (red) RTV. Â Yes, that is the
>> wrong stuff and no it wasn't done well enough to work keep it from leaking.
>>
>>
>> I looked up and brought in the gasket. Â The McCord (now
>> Cooper-Payne/Federal-Mogul) is not in anybody's catalog. Â So, I opted for
>> Fel-Pro (also now owned by Federal-Mogul).
>>
>> The part I used to supply had a coined (the gasket material pre-compressed
>> locally) slot that went up to the little vent hole in the top of the pan
>> edge. Â For reasons I will not go into, we (I was at McCord then) had
>> difficulty maintaining this feature in spec. Â This vent is kind of important
>> so lube will not get forced out through joints and seals. Â The supplied part
>> will have no issue this way as the feature has been eliminated.
>>
>> So, If you can't get your final drive to stay dry, it may be no fault of
>> yours.
>>
>> Matt
>> --
>> Matt & Mary Colie
>> '73 Glacier 23 Chaumiere (say show-me-air)
>> SE Michigan - DTW 3.2/4R
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
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>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: Another disappointment with a supplier [message #106282 is a reply to message #106275] |
Sat, 20 November 2010 09:12 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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Wally,
You seem to have company at that.
Maybe somebody could do a simple kit.
Maybe somebody at Federal Mogul/Fel-Pro will read the note (just short of being a nasty-gram) and get back to me.
JimK says he contacted them as well, but I bet that there are still people there remember me.
We'll see.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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