Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
| [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105127] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 10:14  |
druber
Messages: 58
Registered: March 2004
Location: Syracuse, IN
Karma: 0
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Our coach was vibrating pretty badly under acceleration, particularly when
hitting a dip in the road while accelerating, indicating half shaft
problems. Well, this has been a frustrating week rebuilding them. I had a
couple shafts out of an Eldorado from a junk yard in Austin, TX, which I
first took apart for salvage parts. One outer was no good, but the inners
were in very good shape, and that is what I thought was needed. Next, I
took apart the shafts out of our coach. Both inners and one of the outers
were worn beyond belief. I would say the three balls on the inners had worn
into their sockets 1/16". One of the outers had been rebuilt by somebody
that remachined all the ball races substantially oversized, enough that you
could visually tell the balls were bigger than original ones. The ball
races were in bad shape, being badly fatigued and fretted. That's the
first flag I would like to raise. I wonder if the resizing of those races
was enough to get past the original surface heat treatment, and got into
softer metal thus causing the abnormally high wear, fatigue, and fretting.
The second flag I would like to raise is one that will cause most of your
eyebrows to rise, and that is I packed all these joints about 50000 miles
ago with Mobil 1 grease, and they all looked OK at that time. The grease
did not look good at this point, so that along with the excessive wear makes
me wonder about the wisdom of using Mobil 1 in this application.
The second part of this saga has to do with putting things back together. I
reused the outer boots as they were both the old blue "superboots" that I
think will far outlast any new boots that are available. The third flag I
would like to raise is that the new wave of inner boots will not go onto the
CV joint casting far enough to crimp the sheet metal into the retention
groove in the casting. Evidently the tooling used to make these sheet metal
stampings has worn to the point where the three corners are rounded off
enough so that they do not allow the boot to go onto the casting far enough
to be crimped. The same Chinese guy must make all of them as I tried two
from NAPA and two from Autozone, and they were all the same way. The fourth
and final flag is nothing new. The clamps they supply with these boots and
the clamps you can buy at NAPA and Autozone are not worth carrying home. I
am told that Bob Drewes has found a clamp from McMaster Carr that works like
the old double clamps. Bob, if that is true, would you chime in and let us
in on your findings??
Druber
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105130 is a reply to message #105127] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 10:45  |
GMC_LES
Messages: 569
Registered: October 2009
Location: Montreal
Karma: 0
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My experience with CVJ grease comes from years of VW service. I found that the only grease worth using needed to contain lots of moly. The good CVJ grease is typically a dark grey colour and the consistency of mayonnaise. It often will become more fluid when heated, allowing the grease to circulate somewhat throughout the CVJ.
I haven't used any Mobil 1 grease, but IIRC it is a red grease with a thin consistency. IMO it doesn't contain much moly.
Les Burt
On 2010-11-05, at 11:14 AM, Ray Swartzendruber <redruber@gmail.com> wrote:
> Our coach was vibrating pretty badly under acceleration, particularly when
> hitting a dip in the road while accelerating, indicating half shaft
> problems. Well, this has been a frustrating week rebuilding them. I had a
> couple shafts out of an Eldorado from a junk yard in Austin, TX, which I
> first took apart for salvage parts. One outer was no good, but the inners
> were in very good shape, and that is what I thought was needed. Next, I
> took apart the shafts out of our coach. Both inners and one of the outers
> were worn beyond belief. I would say the three balls on the inners had worn
> into their sockets 1/16". One of the outers had been rebuilt by somebody
> that remachined all the ball races substantially oversized, enough that you
> could visually tell the balls were bigger than original ones. The ball
> races were in bad shape, being badly fatigued and fretted. That's the
> first flag I would like to raise. I wonder if the resizing of those races
> was enough to get past the original surface heat treatment, and got into
> softer metal thus causing the abnormally high wear, fatigue, and fretting.
> The second flag I would like to raise is one that will cause most of your
> eyebrows to rise, and that is I packed all these joints about 50000 miles
> ago with Mobil 1 grease, and they all looked OK at that time. The grease
> did not look good at this point, so that along with the excessive wear makes
> me wonder about the wisdom of using Mobil 1 in this application.
>
>
>
> The second part of this saga has to do with putting things back together. I
> reused the outer boots as they were both the old blue "superboots" that I
> think will far outlast any new boots that are available. The third flag I
> would like to raise is that the new wave of inner boots will not go onto the
> CV joint casting far enough to crimp the sheet metal into the retention
> groove in the casting. Evidently the tooling used to make these sheet metal
> stampings has worn to the point where the three corners are rounded off
> enough so that they do not allow the boot to go onto the casting far enough
> to be crimped. The same Chinese guy must make all of them as I tried two
> from NAPA and two from Autozone, and they were all the same way. The fourth
> and final flag is nothing new. The clamps they supply with these boots and
> the clamps you can buy at NAPA and Autozone are not worth carrying home. I
> am told that Bob Drewes has found a clamp from McMaster Carr that works like
> the old double clamps. Bob, if that is true, would you chime in and let us
> in on your findings??
>
> Druber
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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Les Burt
Montreal
1975 Eleganza 26ft
A work in Progress
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105134 is a reply to message #105127] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 11:07 |
Surbo
Messages: 213
Registered: February 2004
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| druber wrote on Fri, 05 November 2010 10:14 |
Our coach was vibrating pretty badly under acceleration, particularly when
hitting a dip in the road while accelerating, indicating half shaft
problems. The second flag I would like to raise is one that will cause most of your
eyebrows to rise, and that is I packed all these joints about 50000 miles
ago with Mobil 1 grease, and they all looked OK at that time. The grease
did not look good at this point, so that along with the excessive wear makes
me wonder about the wisdom of using Mobil 1 in this application.
The third flag I
would like to raise is that the new wave of inner boots will not go onto the
CV joint casting far enough to crimp the sheet metal into the retention
groove in the casting. I tried two
from NAPA and two from Autozone, and they were all the same way. The fourth
and final flag is nothing new. The clamps they supply with these boots and
the clamps you can buy at NAPA and Autozone are not worth carrying home. I
am told that Bob Drewes has found a clamp from McMaster Carr that works like
the old double clamps. Bob, if that is true, would you chime in and let us
in on your findings??
Druber
|
Ray, could it be the ethanol?? 
You can get the correct bands and clamp from McMaster. http://www.mcmaster.com/# The bands come in a 25 ft roll, and the clamps are packaged 25 to a box. Both are in supply and ready to be shipped. The number for the band is 5422K53 and the number for clamps is 5422K67. The clamps are big enough to let you double wrap the band for the boot. I would recommend the double wrap. If you don't have a tool to do the bands, they have them too.
On the inner boot kit, put the O ring into the groove, fill the groove with black RTV, put the boot can over the casting and use three C clamps and pull the can on as far as you can. This will usually give you enough can to crimp to the casting of the CV joint.
On grease for the CV joints, use only CV joint grease with moly, I would'nt use Mobil 1 grease for anything on the MH, or for anything else, for that matter.
Bob Drewes in SESD
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105145 is a reply to message #105139] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 13:37 |
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I would add to what Bob Cook just said; perhaps he put this info on here some years ago, as I've been using the Cat stuff since I saw the post. It is dark grey, gooey and good.
I also mention that the outer boot that Jim K sells is working good for me and the bands he supplies work OK. I bought my band tool at Napa for about $24.00.
geo groth '73 260 Sequoia
Carson City Nevada 89703
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105156 is a reply to message #105134] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 16:19 |
druber
Messages: 58
Registered: March 2004
Location: Syracuse, IN
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Bob, I can always count on you{:>) The ethanol is the root cause of many
problems, but not this one, I think. That vile stuff has you grinning ear
to ear all the way to the bank this year, doesn't it!!
Do Jim Bounds, or Jim K carry the McMaster Carr parts? Maybe they should.
I don't need 25 feet, nor 25 clamps, but sounds like I need to get them if
no one is carrying them. Jim or Jim, what about it??
I did exactly as you suggest on the inner boots, except for the c clamps.
The red size rubber mallet seemed to give me JUST enough lip to catch the
groove.
Come on Bob, tell us what you REALLY think of Mobil 1 grease!
Ray, could it be the ethanol?? :d
You can get the correct bands and clamp from McMaster.
http://www.mcmaster.com/# The bands come in a 25 ft roll, and the clamps
are packaged 25 to a box. Both are in supply and ready to be shipped. The
number for the band is 5422K53 and the number for clamps is 5422K67. The
clamps are big enough to let you double wrap the band for the boot. I would
recommend the double wrap. If you don't have a tool to do the bands, they
have them too.
On the inner boot kit, put the O ring into the groove, fill the groove with
black RTV, put the boot can over the casting and use three C clamps and pull
the can on as far as you can. This will usually give you enough can to crimp
to the casting of the CV joint.
On grease for the CV joints, use only CV joint grease with moly, I would'nt
use Mobil 1 grease for anything on the MH, or for anything else, for that
matter.
Bob Drewes in SESD
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105174 is a reply to message #105156] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 17:38 |
 |
USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Ray,
I used Valvoline Syn Power grease (with Moly) on the CV joints in Double
Trouble here in the USA when I first bought it. I used Cat Desert Gold (with
Moly) on the CV joints in The Blue Streak (you can't get Valvoline Syn Power
Downunder). BTW Valvoline Syn Power is almost the same as Valvoline Dura
Blend; Syn Power is 100% synthetic and has a slightly wider thermal spec.
I'm going to be pulling down the CV joints in Double Trouble shortly and
will advise what I find.
Jim B sells the banding in short sections. You only need to buy enough for
the outers as you can use the old outer with a new clamp on the inner. For
those of you not lucky enough to have "Blue Boots" I understand it's a good
idea to leave the inner clamps off.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ray Swartzendruber
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 4:19 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Cc: Jim Bounds; jimk@appliedairfilters.com
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
Bob, I can always count on you{:>) The ethanol is the root cause of many
problems, but not this one, I think. That vile stuff has you grinning ear
to ear all the way to the bank this year, doesn't it!!
Do Jim Bounds, or Jim K carry the McMaster Carr parts? Maybe they should.
I don't need 25 feet, nor 25 clamps, but sounds like I need to get them if
no one is carrying them. Jim or Jim, what about it??
I did exactly as you suggest on the inner boots, except for the c clamps.
The red size rubber mallet seemed to give me JUST enough lip to catch the
groove.
Come on Bob, tell us what you REALLY think of Mobil 1 grease!
Ray, could it be the ethanol?? :d
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105190 is a reply to message #105174] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 20:19 |
druber
Messages: 58
Registered: March 2004
Location: Syracuse, IN
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Thanks for the info, Rob. How many miles on Double Trouble since repacking?
Ray
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Rob Mueller
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 6:39 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
Ray,
I used Valvoline Syn Power grease (with Moly) on the CV joints in Double
Trouble here in the USA when I first bought it. I used Cat Desert Gold (with
Moly) on the CV joints in The Blue Streak (you can't get Valvoline Syn Power
Downunder). BTW Valvoline Syn Power is almost the same as Valvoline Dura
Blend; Syn Power is 100% synthetic and has a slightly wider thermal spec.
I'm going to be pulling down the CV joints in Double Trouble shortly and
will advise what I find.
Jim B sells the banding in short sections. You only need to buy enough for
the outers as you can use the old outer with a new clamp on the inner. For
those of you not lucky enough to have "Blue Boots" I understand it's a good
idea to leave the inner clamps off.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ray Swartzendruber
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 4:19 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Cc: Jim Bounds; jimk@appliedairfilters.com
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
Bob, I can always count on you{:>) The ethanol is the root cause of many
problems, but not this one, I think. That vile stuff has you grinning ear
to ear all the way to the bank this year, doesn't it!!
Do Jim Bounds, or Jim K carry the McMaster Carr parts? Maybe they should.
I don't need 25 feet, nor 25 clamps, but sounds like I need to get them if
no one is carrying them. Jim or Jim, what about it??
I did exactly as you suggest on the inner boots, except for the c clamps.
The red size rubber mallet seemed to give me JUST enough lip to catch the
groove.
Come on Bob, tell us what you REALLY think of Mobil 1 grease!
Ray, could it be the ethanol?? :d
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105195 is a reply to message #105190] |
Fri, 05 November 2010 21:02 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Ray,
Unfortunately it's only about 13,000.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ray Swartzendruber
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 8:19 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
Thanks for the info, Rob. How many miles on Double Trouble since repacking?
Ray
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Rob Mueller
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 6:39 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
Ray,
I used Valvoline Syn Power grease (with Moly) on the CV joints in Double
Trouble here in the USA when I first bought it. I used Cat Desert Gold (with
Moly) on the CV joints in The Blue Streak (you can't get Valvoline Syn Power
Downunder). BTW Valvoline Syn Power is almost the same as Valvoline Dura
Blend; Syn Power is 100% synthetic and has a slightly wider thermal spec.
I'm going to be pulling down the CV joints in Double Trouble shortly and
will advise what I find.
Jim B sells the banding in short sections. You only need to buy enough for
the outers as you can use the old outer with a new clamp on the inner. For
those of you not lucky enough to have "Blue Boots" I understand it's a good
idea to leave the inner clamps off.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ray Swartzendruber
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 4:19 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Cc: Jim Bounds; jimk@appliedairfilters.com
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story
Bob, I can always count on you{:>) The ethanol is the root cause of many
problems, but not this one, I think. That vile stuff has you grinning ear
to ear all the way to the bank this year, doesn't it!!
Do Jim Bounds, or Jim K carry the McMaster Carr parts? Maybe they should.
I don't need 25 feet, nor 25 clamps, but sounds like I need to get them if
no one is carrying them. Jim or Jim, what about it??
I did exactly as you suggest on the inner boots, except for the c clamps.
The red size rubber mallet seemed to give me JUST enough lip to catch the
groove.
Come on Bob, tell us what you REALLY think of Mobil 1 grease!
Ray, could it be the ethanol?? :d
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105215 is a reply to message #105127] |
Sat, 06 November 2010 01:48 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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I had a similar problem using Mobil 1 in my rear wheel bearings a few years back. It turned to a liquid oil and ran out of the bearings. Luckily for me Blaine Merrell spotted it when I had my coach on his hoist and we repacked all 4 of them before any real damage was done.
My Dave Lenzi rebuilt front hub bearings have Valvoline Synnpower grease in them. When I spotted the Mobil 1 in them I called Dave. He said he chose Mobil 1 only because it was available nationwide and he had no special attraction to it. He had no problems with me changing the grease to something with MSO2 in it (meaning Valvoline). He also said he expected people to change the front bearing grease every 12,000 miles. I have the grease zerks in mine.
I have not found any good use for Mobil 1 grease or oil other than maybe starting a campfire.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105232 is a reply to message #105127] |
Sat, 06 November 2010 11:33 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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I called Cinnabar to ask about my crispy selfdestructing outer boots with only a few thousand miles on them. They had not heard of this though they did install them. They did say that the greenish grease is what Saginaw (maker of the CV assemblies) recommended as the only grease to use. So, I guess that is what I will use though I wonder if there a compatibility issue with the current rubber product. I did not reccognise the voice, but when I asked I found out it was Wes I was talking to. The current boot they provide is longer to prevent pullback issues. I think I'll go with what Jim K has though wondering if he provides the green grease. My opinion on Mobile 1 is it is good at first but has the state separation issues after some time with watery runoff. If I didn't go with the green stuff next choice would be Synpower. I wonder if adding some the new Zpaste assembly lube would be of benefit.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105273 is a reply to message #105232] |
Sat, 06 November 2010 17:24 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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| JohnL455 wrote on Sat, 06 November 2010 11:33 |
I called Cinnabar to ask about my crispy selfdestructing outer boots with only a few thousand miles on them. They had not heard of this though they did install them. They did say that the greenish grease is what Saginaw (maker of the CV assemblies) recommended as the only grease to use. So, I guess that is what I will use though I wonder if there a compatibility issue with the current rubber product. I did not reccognise the voice, but when I asked I found out it was Wes I was talking to. The current boot they provide is longer to prevent pullback issues. I think I'll go with what Jim K has though wondering if he provides the green grease. My opinion on Mobile 1 is it is good at first but has the state separation issues after some time with watery runoff. If I didn't go with the green stuff next choice would be Synpower. I wonder if adding some the new Zpaste assembly lube would be of benefit.
|
Blaine Merrell had a large quantity of the green CV joint grease for sale. He had it on his table at several rallys. You might give him a call and have him send you some.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105281 is a reply to message #105215] |
Sat, 06 November 2010 18:52 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I just yesterday repacked 3 rear wheel bearings. Two had Mobil 1, it was in
good shape, with no sign of breakdown or bleeding. But, it probably had
only 50,000 miles on it. I was surprised to find that lacquer thinner
wouldn't remove it. Mineral spirits did fine. The bearings looked perfect.
I repacked them with Valvoline Synpower.
The third had Synpower. The tale was the same as those with Mobil 1,
including being impervious to lacquer thinner, but only had about 10,000
miles on it. I repacked it with the same stuff.
After seeing all the other bearings, I didn't bother to repack the fourth
set, which also had only 10,000 miles on Synpower and I was simply pulling
and immediately replacing the hub.
Obviously, I prefer Synpower for everything, but I haven't had any problem
with Mobil 1 other than it bleeding badly while still in the tube. But
then, I've had the same problem with Synpower -- just not nearly as bad.
Ken H.
On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 2:48 AM, Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
> I had a similar problem using Mobil 1 in my rear wheel bearings a few years
> back. It turned to a liquid oil and ran out of the bearings. Luckily for
> me Blaine Merrell spotted it when I had my coach on his hoist and we
> repacked all 4 of them before any real damage was done.
> ...
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105315 is a reply to message #105281] |
Sat, 06 November 2010 23:28 |
Richard Denney
Messages: 920
Registered: April 2010
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net>wrote:
> Obviously, I prefer Synpower for everything, but I haven't had any problem
> with Mobil 1 other than it bleeding badly while still in the tube. But
> then, I've had the same problem with Synpower -- just not nearly as bad.
>
>
It should be noted that Mobil 1's container (at least the one I read) does
not list CV joints as an application. Synpower does. Wheel bearings don't
normally put the same demands on grease as do CV joints, but the Synpower is
also rated for temperatures up to 450 degrees, while Mobil 1 is only 250 or
275 as I recall. For wheel bearings connected to hot rotors and brake drums,
I would think that would be a problem. Ken probably didn't have trouble with
the Mobil 1 in the rear because he didn't install brakes on the rear wheels,
so I wonder if those were the ones with the Mobil 1.
While Mobil 1 is probably fine for wheel bearings, the consequences of a
rear wheel bearing failure are not wonderful. I recall an episode where the
late Skip Newhouse has a rear bearing failure that caused the spindle and
hub to melt before the wheel fell off. Tom Hampton got to fix that one, as I
recall. While the belief at the time was that someone forgot to loosen the
castle nut after tightening it down to seat the bearing, it does make me
realize that a failure of a rear bearing is not a good thing. When I repack
the rear bearings, I'll use Synpower.
Rick "who learned about Mobil 1 grease on the steering CV joint" Denney
--
'73 230 "Jaws"
Northern Virginia
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - Any new technologies? [message #105320 is a reply to message #105127] |
Sun, 07 November 2010 06:21 |
JimGunther
Messages: 228
Registered: March 2007
Location: West Haven, CT
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I'm just throwing this out for......well, not to start trouble.
Just "bench racing"
Has anybody investigated the technology / improvements Front Wheel drive (or AWD) racers have incorporated over the last few years to deal with front wheel drive failures, in general, and CV joint failures in particular?
I remember remarking (when NHRA was promoting Import Drag racong several years ago) that the guy who invented a break-proof half-shaft, would become a Zillion-aire.Well, reliability in those extreme conditions has improved enormosly. They must be doing something right, eh?
Jim Gunther
www.LotusV6.com
now former owner - ;(
73 GMC-II 2600
by Explorer
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105321 is a reply to message #105315] |
Sun, 07 November 2010 06:31 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Rick,
You're right: The Mobil 1 filled bearings were from the aft wheels which
have not had brakes for most of those 50,000 miles. Those with Synpower
were on the mid axle; I repacked them while installing the small calipers
several years ago.
Ken H.
On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 12:28 AM, Richard Denney <rwdenney@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net
> >wrote:
>
> > Obviously, I prefer Synpower for everything, but I haven't had any
> problem
> > with Mobil 1 other than it bleeding badly while still in the tube. But
> > then, I've had the same problem with Synpower -- just not nearly as bad.
> >
> >
> ...Ken probably didn't have trouble with
> the Mobil 1 in the rear because he didn't install brakes on the rear
> wheels,
> so I wonder if those were the ones with the Mobil 1.
> ...
> Rick "who learned about Mobil 1 grease on the steering CV joint" Denney
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Half Shafts - long sob story [message #105323 is a reply to message #105321] |
Sun, 07 November 2010 08:03 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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G'day,
Here's another "story" that supports Ken B's evaluation of Mobil 1 grease!
Double Trouble has Caddy calipers/disks on the front and middle axles and
drums on the rear axles.
On the way from Key West back to the COOP in Orlando to fix a problem that
had cropped up with the Power Level pump relay I stopped at an RV shop to
check and see if they had anything that I couldn't live without. As I left
the coach I applied the parking brake. This was not a normal thing for me to
do. At any rate when I came out with a great little plastic box for eggs I
got in, started the engine, put it drive, and pulled out. Yup, I forgot to
release the parking brake. When we got to the COOP later that day I looked
down and saw it was on, DAMN! I released it then and there. Jim B fixed the
relay and so the next day we were wheels up for Ken and Elaine Henderson's
home in Americus.
While we were at Ken's home I decided to pull the passenger side drum just
have a look see. I picked the passenger side as it was easier to get to at
the time. We did that and found nothing wrong mechanically and the Mobil 1
grease was good. I ASSUMED that the drivers side would be OK too.
From there we headed for Chuck and Cathy Boyd's home in Knoxville. When we
headed for DuQuoin I noted slight rumbling noise down back. It sounded like
a wheel bearing not a brake problem.
As I pulled into my parking spot at DuQuoin Bob Price noted "boy, your
drivers side rear wheel is making a hell of a lot of noise!" I said thanks
and told him that I had heard a rumbling back there.
When I removed the drivers side brake drum a bunch of "stuff" fell out! It
turns out that "something" had failed and the springs that hold the shoes to
the backing plate were in pieces.
Bob Stone brought me used parts to fix the problem and I was (as we say
Downunder) happy as Larry! I DID NOT take the coach for a test drive; I
ASSUMED I had fixed the problem.
From DuQuoin we headed for Dan and Teri Gregg's home in Dexter. As soon as
we hit the highway the rumbling came back. When we got to Dexter Dan and I
took Double Trouble out for a test ride and I could tell that the noise came
from the passenger side. Since I had removed the rear wheel and brake drum
at Ken's and knew it was OK it had to be the middle wheel and brake disk.
When I pulled the wheel and disk I found the bearings to be dry and
discolored from heat. There was dried out grease in the middle of the hub
which was red. This makes sense as all four wheel bearings were serviced by
Ken Frey when he replaced the rear disks with drums so I could have an
emergency brake needed to pass NJ state inspection. This was about 13,000
miles ago.
Dan and I replaced all the wheel bearings on the middle axles and greased
them with Valvoline Synpower. This time I DID NOT ASSUME I fixed the problem
and took Double Trouble for a test run to make bloody sure I had!
Epilog: I have new brake drums, carbon metallic brake shoes, bearings,
seals, and spring kits for the rears which I will be replacing before I head
back Downunder.
I am also going to pull the front wheel bearings out of the D. Lenzi
hubs/knuckles and replace the Mobil 1 with Valvoline Synpower. I will then
only have to carry ONE grease gun.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
Ken Henderson
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2010 6:32 AM
Rick,
You're right: The Mobil 1 filled bearings were from the aft wheels which
have not had brakes for most of those 50,000 miles. Those with Synpower
were on the mid axle; I repacked them while installing the small calipers
several years ago.
Ken H.
On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 12:28 AM, Richard Denney <rwdenney@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net
> >wrote:
>
> > Obviously, I prefer Synpower for everything, but I haven't had any
> problem
> > with Mobil 1 other than it bleeding badly while still in the tube. But
> > then, I've had the same problem with Synpower -- just not nearly as bad.
> >
> >
> ...Ken probably didn't have trouble with
> the Mobil 1 in the rear because he didn't install brakes on the rear
> wheels,
> so I wonder if those were the ones with the Mobil 1.
> ...
> Rick "who learned about Mobil 1 grease on the steering CV joint" Denney
>
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List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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