| Engine crank seal [message #103848] |
Fri, 22 October 2010 21:20  |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Looks like I have something to add to the seal saga. Today I rigged up a hoist to lift the front of my 455 engine as my front seal is leaking like a sieve. The odd thing about it is my engine only has 5,000 miles on it and it started leaking at around 2,000 miles. What I found is the dampener is in great shape but the seal is hard like a 100,000 mile seal. What ever this new seal is made out of it can't take the heat of a hard working motor. It never got over 260 degrees (oil sump). Only a very short time at this temperature. I have the Aluminum radiator with the internal oil cooler and I also have a large external oil cooler in series after the internal one. The engine water never got over 220 degrees. The problem seal is a National #472082. I called Felpro (it came in the Felpro gasket set)and asked them if there was something different in the seal material and they of course said no. I seem to remember Ken Henderson was also having a problem with front seals in his new Cadillac engine. Does anyone know of a seal manufacturer that can take the heat, this is far too much work for changing faulty manufactured parts even if I were a young man. Also if I have any more problems with the rear seal I will get rid of the 460 Ford and go back to the rope seal.
Roy
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal [message #103857 is a reply to message #103848] |
Fri, 22 October 2010 22:54  |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Roy,
I sure feel for you with that seal problem. There seem to be a lot of us
having similar problems. But my problem at the front of the Cad500 was not
the crankshaft seal. I did something wrong with the cam gear cover gasket.
I don't know what, but I seem to have successfully repaired it; at least
I've had no leaks for the past 2000 miles or so. Still don't know how I
could have repaired it in the coach when I couldn't assemble it correctly on
the engine stand.
But Larry W. has reported having a lot of trouble stopping his Cad500
crankshaft seal from leaking. I don't know whether he's found a bad seal
though.
Ken H.
On Fri, Oct 22, 2010 at 10:20 PM, roy keen <roynpaula@charter.net> wrote:
>
>
> Looks like I have something to add to the seal saga. Today I rigged up a
> hoist to lift the front of my 455 engine as my front seal is leaking like a
> sieve...
I seem to remember Ken Henderson was also having a problem with front seals
> in his new Cadillac engine...
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal [message #103903 is a reply to message #103857] |
Sat, 23 October 2010 11:45 |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Ken:
The thought had not entered my mind that the new seal had been too hot I was thinking a problem with the dampener. Until I removed it that is. This engine has run cooler if anything since I installed the new aluminum radiator ,it was obvious the new seal was stiffer then it should be and looser on the dampener then you would expect. When I flexed it hard it cracked. The only explanation is the seal material can't take as much heat as the previous seals I have been using in the past 25 years as this engine generally runs cooler then it used too. It would be nice if I could find a source for a silicon or via con seal I
sure don't want to put a similar seal back in its place and do this again in a few thousand miles.
Kind of hard to mess up a cover seal possibly a leak past the fastener threads?
Roy
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal [message #103915 is a reply to message #103903] |
Sat, 23 October 2010 14:03 |
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jaholland
Messages: 565
Registered: June 2010
Location: Sweet Home Alebamy
Karma: 0
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Roy;
Let us know when you find a better seal because I have just noticed a slight leak on the front of my '403 ~
It is going to push up my springtime scheduled Timing Chain/Gear Replacement ~
Now I am considering replacing the camshaft at the same time with the Caspro TruRoller Camshaft / Lifters ~
$ $ $ $ $ $ for the GMC
{ Front Seals / Timing Chain & Gears / Camshaft & Lifters }
~ Joe ~
{ I married a Morton ~ "When It Rains - It Pours " }
~ Matching $ $ $ $ $ $ for Momma just to keep her happy ~
/_]*[__][] *[__|] ~ * '73 TZE063V101887 "
"
O----------OO--]* ~ '78 TZE168V100234 "
"
" Joe & Lavelle " "
"
'sweet home alebamy'
[Updated on: Sat, 23 October 2010 14:11] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal [message #103936 is a reply to message #103915] |
Sat, 23 October 2010 18:26 |
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Roy, I don't know what Howie used on my 455; I'll check w/him and call you tomorrow. I developed a bad miss on my way home from Sacramento and am trying to fix that now. Tranny temp went to 210 degrees and water to 210 also. I'm going to change the fluid in the tranny. Do you think synthetic would be better, and if so, does it blend ok with whatever is left in the tranny?
geo groth '73 260 Sequoia
Carson City Nevada 89703
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal [message #103949 is a reply to message #103936] |
Sat, 23 October 2010 20:46 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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George,
Manny told me to use Mobil 1 Synthetic trans fluid. Yes it is compatible
with other trans fluids.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of George Groth
Sent: Saturday, October 23, 2010 6:27 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal
Roy, I don't know what Howie used on my 455; I'll check w/him and call you
tomorrow. I developed a bad miss on my way home from Sacramento and am
trying to fix that now. Tranny temp went to 210 degrees and water to 210
also. I'm going to change the fluid in the tranny. Do you think synthetic
would be better, and if so, does it blend ok with whatever is left in the
tranny?
--
geo groth '73 260 Sequoia
Carson City Nevada
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: Engine crank seal [message #104141 is a reply to message #103848] |
Mon, 25 October 2010 13:20 |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Well I did some research on seals. It seams the National #472082
is a nit rile seal as was all the other seals listed for the 455 engine. I called Skf-C&R and their seal is a #19922 that replaces the National #472082 . It is also nit rile and the temperature rating is 250 degrees F. on the high end. They also have a #19923 seal that is the same dimensions but is made out of polyacrylite and is good for 350F. I can live with this temperature rating better then the 250 degree one. Skf says it would work well in the crankcase oil. I ordered one from E.B.Atmus co. on line for $10 it is coming from Tenn.
Roy
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine crank seal [message #104282 is a reply to message #104250] |
Tue, 26 October 2010 12:52 |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Larry:
I checked it out on the SKF web site. It is identical to the seal we are all using in the 455 (don't know if the 403 is the same) bore 2",width .375,O.D. 2.884,bore 2.88. style CRWA1 (double lip) The only difference according to SKF is it has a higher temperature rating (350 degrees)using Polyacrylite instead oy nitrile.
It is also designed for oil use. It sounds like what I was looking for. If it lasts more then 2,000 miles I guess I am ahead of the game as the Nitrile seal was leaking so bad I could look up at the engine while it was idling and see the oil running out of the seal.
Roy
Good luck - and keep us posted. If you could snap a picture of this seal an post it I'm sure we'd all like to see it.
Larry Davick
The Mystery Machine
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[/quote]
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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