| rear brake shoe issue [message #103572] |
Wed, 20 October 2010 12:03  |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
Karma: 0
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John Nicholls had a problem with the left center drum over heating. he found the following problem. i tried to upload the photos to the photo site but was unable to connect. i will try again. John said he ordered shoes by the part number in the GMCMI parts list. are there other shoe numbers available?
""The emergency brake lever is capable of being installed incorrectly on the rear brake shoes. I recently encountered this issue. Ken Frey and Stephen Galovic co-authored an article for the December 1992 issue of “Motorhome Marketplace” which documented and described this issue. If installed incorrectly (as I did), the shoes remain spread affecting wear and emergency braking capability. Photo “brake shoes wrong” shows my new work installed incorrectly (to high) and the photo “brake shoes correct” shows the correct installation. There is one other mismatch where the lever is installed to low.
The issue is with the brake shoes. It looks like there are 3 different configurations of shoes. The difference is the dimension from the triangle slot where the emergency lever hooks into the shoe and the slots where the emergency brake strut fits the shoe. on some shoes the slots in the shoe are too high and in some the slots are too low. the pic's show the correct and too high installation. the only way to correct this is to get the correct shoes. it doesn't look like the problem is with the lever it is with the shoes themselves.
John Nicholls
additional info
Fred Veenschoten""
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: rear brake shoe issue [message #103578 is a reply to message #103572] |
Wed, 20 October 2010 13:14  |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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he bought the shoes from a local parts store using the GMCMI number. he has now ordered shoes from John Evans as replacements.
when we get to the bottom of this do you want to add this issue to your web site?
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: rear brake shoe issue [message #103681 is a reply to message #103572] |
Thu, 21 October 2010 11:27 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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OK, here is what happened. John Nicholls went to the GMCMI parts interchange book from 2007 and found part no. 272DR listed for '73-'75 coaches. he then went to NAPA and bought part no. TS272. this is the wrong shoe.
from the PDF file "parking brake improvement" GM had a recall and changed the shoes and the brake lever on most all coaches. the part no. in the exchange list should be deleted or a note added to warn folks to check the fit of the lever before installing those shoes. the shoes from John Evans are the updated shoes and should work if the recall has been done by GM.
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: [GMCnet] rear brake shoe issue [message #103705 is a reply to message #103689] |
Thu, 21 October 2010 17:30 |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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I recall reading on the GMCCoop site that the recommended rear brake shoes should be riveted and not adhesive bonded -- Any experiences or current feedback?
Dennis
| Bill Massey wrote on Thu, 21 October 2010 13:26 |
The number in the Interchange Index is a Wagner number. NAPA does not go by
the same number. The TS denotes NAPA supplier "TruStop". The stated DR
suffix is a part of the number, it is not the same.
www.napaonline.com/Search/Detail.aspx?R=RTSTS272_0064107302
From my digging this morning I have learned that brake shoes for a 1965
through 1970 Pontiac Bonneville are interchangeable. I have found several
part numbers from several different manufacturers so I think it best to just
ask for these shoes rather than quoting a part number which seems to change
with the seasons.
=======================
This quote is from the GMCMI Newsletter #14, Page 3, dated January 1986:
The following rear brake parts are the same as a 19656 - 1970 Pontiac
Bonneville
Brake Linings 5470830
Brake Spring Kit 2620857
Wheel Cyl Assy 5469302
Spring Hold Down Kit 5472515
=======================
I will note in the Interchange that the 272-DR is obsolete unless someone
determines that it still exists. The reference about the Bonneville shoes
is already listed.
Please keep informed of developments on this issue.
bdub
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Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: [GMCnet] rear brake shoe issue [message #103854 is a reply to message #103705] |
Fri, 22 October 2010 22:42 |
gmcrv1
Messages: 839
Registered: August 2007
Location: Memphis
Karma: -1
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Senior Member |
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Dennis,
As far back as I can remember, we always used riveted linings on the drum
brakes. As the lining would wear, the softer rivets (brass?) would make
noise to warn that the lining was at the point where it needed replacement -
saving the drum from being scored. Much like the noises made by disk pads
that need replacement. I have also heard - but never experienced that the
bonded shoes could break loose from the shoe.
Tom
On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Dennis Sexton <dennisfsexton@aol.com>wrote:
>
>
> I recall reading on the GMCCoop site that the recommended rear brake shoes
> should be riveted and not adhesive bonded -- Any experiences or current
> feedback?
>
> Dennis
>
> Bill Massey wrote on Thu, 21 October 2010 13:26
> > The number in the Interchange Index is a Wagner number. NAPA does not go
> by
> > the same number. The TS denotes NAPA supplier "TruStop". The stated DR
> > suffix is a part of the number, it is not the same.
> > www.napaonline.com/Search/Detail.aspx?R=RTSTS272_0064107302
> >
> > From my digging this morning I have learned that brake shoes for a 1965
> > through 1970 Pontiac Bonneville are interchangeable. I have found
> several
> > part numbers from several different manufacturers so I think it best to
> just
> > ask for these shoes rather than quoting a part number which seems to
> change
> > with the seasons.
> >
> > =======================
> > This quote is from the GMCMI Newsletter #14, Page 3, dated January 1986:
> > The following rear brake parts are the same as a 19656 - 1970 Pontiac
> > Bonneville
> > Brake Linings 5470830
> > Brake Spring Kit 2620857
> > Wheel Cyl Assy 5469302
> > Spring Hold Down Kit 5472515
> > =======================
> >
> > I will note in the Interchange that the 272-DR is obsolete unless someone
> > determines that it still exists. The reference about the Bonneville
> shoes
> > is already listed.
> >
> > Please keep informed of developments on this issue.
> >
> > bdub
>
>
> --
> Dennis S
> 73 Painted Desert 230
> Germantown, TN
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] rear brake shoe issue [message #103856 is a reply to message #103854] |
Fri, 22 October 2010 22:50 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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You should only use shoes that have riveted linings.
J.R. Wright
On Oct 22, 2010, at 11:42 PM, Tom Eckert wrote:
> Dennis,
>
> As far back as I can remember, we always used riveted linings on the
> drum
> brakes. As the lining would wear, the softer rivets (brass?) would
> make
> noise to warn that the lining was at the point where it needed
> replacement -
> saving the drum from being scored. Much like the noises made by
> disk pads
> that need replacement. I have also heard - but never experienced
> that the
> bonded shoes could break loose from the shoe.
>
> Tom
>
> On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Dennis Sexton
> <dennisfsexton@aol.com>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> I recall reading on the GMCCoop site that the recommended rear
>> brake shoes
>> should be riveted and not adhesive bonded -- Any experiences or
>> current
>> feedback?
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>> Bill Massey wrote on Thu, 21 October 2010 13:26
>>> The number in the Interchange Index is a Wagner number. NAPA does
>>> not go
>> by
>>> the same number. The TS denotes NAPA supplier "TruStop". The
>>> stated DR
>>> suffix is a part of the number, it is not the same.
>>> www.napaonline.com/Search/Detail.aspx?R=RTSTS272_0064107302
>>>
>>> From my digging this morning I have learned that brake shoes for a
>>> 1965
>>> through 1970 Pontiac Bonneville are interchangeable. I have found
>> several
>>> part numbers from several different manufacturers so I think it
>>> best to
>> just
>>> ask for these shoes rather than quoting a part number which seems to
>> change
>>> with the seasons.
>>>
>>> =======================
>>> This quote is from the GMCMI Newsletter #14, Page 3, dated January
>>> 1986:
>>> The following rear brake parts are the same as a 19656 - 1970
>>> Pontiac
>>> Bonneville
>>> Brake Linings 5470830
>>> Brake Spring Kit 2620857
>>> Wheel Cyl Assy 5469302
>>> Spring Hold Down Kit 5472515
>>> =======================
>>>
>>> I will note in the Interchange that the 272-DR is obsolete unless
>>> someone
>>> determines that it still exists. The reference about the Bonneville
>> shoes
>>> is already listed.
>>>
>>> Please keep informed of developments on this issue.
>>>
>>> bdub
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dennis S
>> 73 Painted Desert 230
>> Germantown, TN
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] rear brake shoe issue [message #103862 is a reply to message #103854] |
Fri, 22 October 2010 23:42 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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Back when the linings were manufactured with asbestos, the adhesive bonded
linings were nearly a match for the riveted ones. With the advent of
replacement friction materials, the adhesives previously used are not as
effective at securing the lining to the shoes. The superior material now is
clearly the riveted linings. There are heavy duty and severe duty linings
available now which exceed the old asbestos material in stopping ability but
not in durability. I personally use a semi-metallic lining on the rear
wheels & it does a good job for me.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 Royale 403
On Fri, Oct 22, 2010 at 8:42 PM, Tom Eckert <gmcrv1@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dennis,
>
> As far back as I can remember, we always used riveted linings on the drum
> brakes. As the lining would wear, the softer rivets (brass?) would make
> noise to warn that the lining was at the point where it needed replacement
> -
> saving the drum from being scored. Much like the noises made by disk pads
> that need replacement. I have also heard - but never experienced that the
> bonded shoes could break loose from the shoe.
>
> Tom
>
> On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Dennis Sexton <dennisfsexton@aol.com
> >wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > I recall reading on the GMCCoop site that the recommended rear brake
> shoes
> > should be riveted and not adhesive bonded -- Any experiences or current
> > feedback?
> >
> > Dennis
> >
> > Bill Massey wrote on Thu, 21 October 2010 13:26
> > > The number in the Interchange Index is a Wagner number. NAPA does not
> go
> > by
> > > the same number. The TS denotes NAPA supplier "TruStop". The stated
> DR
> > > suffix is a part of the number, it is not the same.
> > > www.napaonline.com/Search/Detail.aspx?R=RTSTS272_0064107302
> > >
> > > From my digging this morning I have learned that brake shoes for a 1965
> > > through 1970 Pontiac Bonneville are interchangeable. I have found
> > several
> > > part numbers from several different manufacturers so I think it best to
> > just
> > > ask for these shoes rather than quoting a part number which seems to
> > change
> > > with the seasons.
> > >
> > > =======================
> > > This quote is from the GMCMI Newsletter #14, Page 3, dated January
> 1986:
> > > The following rear brake parts are the same as a 19656 - 1970 Pontiac
> > > Bonneville
> > > Brake Linings 5470830
> > > Brake Spring Kit 2620857
> > > Wheel Cyl Assy 5469302
> > > Spring Hold Down Kit 5472515
> > > =======================
> > >
> > > I will note in the Interchange that the 272-DR is obsolete unless
> someone
> > > determines that it still exists. The reference about the Bonneville
> > shoes
> > > is already listed.
> > >
> > > Please keep informed of developments on this issue.
> > >
> > > bdub
> >
> >
> > --
> > Dennis S
> > 73 Painted Desert 230
> > Germantown, TN
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > List Information and Subscription Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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