Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Cam Timing
| [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #102907] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 22:24  |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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G'day,
The Edelbrock timing chain set we installed at the Coop was one that allowed
you to advance or retard the timing 4 degrees. I chose to install it at 0
degrees.
I have been wondering if it would be worth while to get in there and advance
it 4 degrees as that would shift the torque/power band down a bit.
Ken Frey told me that when he built the engine he would have put an "RV" cam
in it.
Waddaya think?
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #102914 is a reply to message #102910] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 23:00  |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Gary,
I do!
Er might, er let me think about it some more!
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Kosier
Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:45 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
I say, advance it!
But, then again, no one ever pays an attention to me.
Gary Kosier
77EII & 77PB
Newark, Ohio
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Mueller" <robmueller@iinet.net.au>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:24 PM
Subject: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
> G'day,
>
> The Edelbrock timing chain set we installed at the Coop was one
> that allowed
> you to advance or retard the timing 4 degrees. I chose to
> install it at 0
> degrees.
>
> I have been wondering if it would be worth while to get in
> there and advance
> it 4 degrees as that would shift the torque/power band down a
> bit.
>
> Ken Frey told me that when he built the engine he would have
> put an "RV" cam
> in it.
>
> Waddaya think?
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> USAussie
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #102933 is a reply to message #102907] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 08:06 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| Robert Mueller wrote on Wed, 13 October 2010 23:24 |
G'day,
The Edelbrock timing chain set we installed at the Coop was one that allowed you to advance or retard the timing 4 degrees. I chose to install it at 0 degrees.
I have been wondering if it would be worth while to get in there and advance it 4 degrees as that would shift the torque/power band down a bit.
Ken Frey told me that when he built the engine he would have put an "RV" cam in it.
Waddaya think?
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
|
Rob,
There are really several issues here that have be included.
Does Ken know which "RV" cam he put in the engine and can you get the data? (That is actually 2.)
Was the cam actually installed at ZERO?? (There are often manufacturing variations that can cause a couple of degrees of the design center.)
Now my opinion. (You know what is said about opinions.)
Would it be worth the effort?
Personally - I rather doubt it.
A large reason for that opinion is the torque converted slip at low speeds. If it is truly an RV cam, it is already ground with preference for low end performance.
If I were in your position (not much chance there - I have a transmission to take out), I would go out and (with good conditions and the engine at operating temperature) and do a second gear WOT run. Can you feel the engine "come on the cam"??
If that is above the normal engine speed range, the cam shift might be of interest.
If it is not then find something else to fiddle with today.
Well there you go. You know how expensive free advice can be.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #102943 is a reply to message #102933] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 09:32 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Matt,
Responses in CAPS below:
Thanks,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Matt Colie
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2010 8:06 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
Rob,
There are really several issues here that have be included.
Does Ken know which "RV" cam he put in the engine and can you get the data?
(That is actually 2.)
1) NOPE THE ENGINE WAS BUILT IN 1993
2) NOPE
Was the cam actually installed at ZERO?? (There are often manufacturing
variations that can cause a couple of degrees of the design center.)
WE JUST USED THE ZERO SETTING ON THE EDELBROCK CAM GEAR SET - WE DID NOT
CHECK IT WITH A DEGREE WHEEL.
Now my opinion. (You know what is said about opinions.)
Would it be worth the effort?
Personally - I rather doubt it.
A large reason for that opinion is the torque converted slip at low speeds.
If it is truly an RV cam, it is already ground with preference for low end
performance.
If I were in your position (not much chance there - I have a transmission to
take out), I would go out and (with good conditions and the engine at
operating temperature) and do a second gear WOT run. Can you feel the
engine "come on the cam"??
GOOD IDEA - WILL DO WHEN I GET THE CHANCE.
If that is above the normal engine speed range, the cam shift might be of
interest.
I NOTE THAT THIS ENGINE REALLY LIKES TO RUN AT 70 MPH WHICH ACCORDING TO THE
CHEAP HARBOR FREIGHT TACH IS 2800 RPM.
If it is not then find something else to fiddle with today.
HELEN IS LEAVING ON SUNDAY AND THEREFORE THE "HONEY DO" LIST IS TOP
PRIORITY!
Well there you go. You know how expensive free advice can be.
Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie
'73 Glacier 23 Chaumiere (say show-me-air)
SE Michigan - DTW 3.2/4R
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #103002 is a reply to message #102914] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 20:06 |
Kosier
Messages: 834
Registered: February 2008
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Rob,
With the 76cc heads and more lift in the cam, you would do well
to check valve clearance carefully.
Gary Kosier
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Mueller" <robmueller@iinet.net.au>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2010 12:00 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
> Gary,
>
> I do!
>
> Er might, er let me think about it some more!
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> USAussie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Kosier
> Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:45 PM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
>
> I say, advance it!
> But, then again, no one ever pays an attention to me.
>
> Gary Kosier
> 77EII & 77PB
> Newark, Ohio
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rob Mueller" <robmueller@iinet.net.au>
> To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 11:24 PM
> Subject: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
>
>
>> G'day,
>>
>> The Edelbrock timing chain set we installed at the Coop was
>> one
>> that allowed
>> you to advance or retard the timing 4 degrees. I chose to
>> install it at 0
>> degrees.
>>
>> I have been wondering if it would be worth while to get in
>> there and advance
>> it 4 degrees as that would shift the torque/power band down a
>> bit.
>>
>> Ken Frey told me that when he built the engine he would have
>> put an "RV" cam
>> in it.
>>
>> Waddaya think?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Rob M.
>> USAussie
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #103006 is a reply to message #103002] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 20:29 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Gary,
Good point!
Jerry Potter has told me that he'll walk me through the assembly. I'll cc
the GMC net and get that input as well.
I'll call him up and tell him "today I'm installing the crankshaft" and
he'll walk me through that step by step.
When that's done I call him and note "today I'm putting the rings on the
pistons" and he'll walk me through that step by step.
And so on.
Regards,
Rob M.
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Kosier
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2010 8:07 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
Rob,
With the 76cc heads and more lift in the cam, you would do well
to check valve clearance carefully.
Gary Kosier
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing [message #103077 is a reply to message #103071] |
Fri, 15 October 2010 13:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Shan,
Don't remember - it's one that Jerry Potter recommended for operation at low
rpm on AutoGas (60% LPG / 40% Butane).
By the way I contacted all three of the Caddy 500 builders / parts suppliers
and decided to go with Jerry because he's been building them longer than
anyone else.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Shan Rose
Sent: Friday, October 15, 2010 12:16 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Cam Timing
Rob, What kinda cam are you installing? Is it ine of the MTS cams? They have
some good grinds...
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GMCnet mailing list
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_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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