Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » fuel filter questions (at the carb)
| fuel filter questions [message #102811] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 14:03  |
bukzin
Messages: 840
Registered: April 2004
Location: North California
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Questions about the stock filter up on the carb.
Is there a correct direction; can it be put in backwards
by mistake?
Someone said something about 'blowing thru it' to test.
How is this done?
About how often do you guys change these out; miles/years?
Which part number do you like, or just anything
they have in stock at the auto parts store?
Mine is all stock (no electric fuel pump)
with a 403 engine.
Bukzin
1977 Palm Beach
[Updated on: Wed, 13 October 2010 14:55] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: fuel filter questions [message #102812 is a reply to message #102811] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 14:28  |
roy1
Messages: 2126
Registered: July 2004
Location: Minden nevada
Karma: 6
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Richard
Yes you can put it in back wards and it won't allow gas to flow to the carb. There are 2 kinds 1 with a check valve and 1 without. I prefer the one without but either one is OK as far as I am concerned. The open end should face away from the carb.
Some guys remove this filter when using a larger filter down by the electric pump. I have both in mine as it is still possible to pick up debree from the electric pump to the carb. It is likely you can go for years with out changing it as the filter at the electric pump will get dirty first. Just get one for a 455 or 403 Olds. The early ones had no check valve the later ones had a check valve. If you can blow through it with lung pressure it isn't plugged.
Roy
Roy Keen
Minden,NV
76 X Glenbrook
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| Re: fuel filter questions [message #102815 is a reply to message #102811] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 14:49 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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| bukzin wrote on Wed, 13 October 2010 14:03 |
Questions about the stock filter up on the carb.
Is there a correct direction; can it be put in backwards
by mistake?
Someone said something about 'blowing thru it' to test.
How is this done?
About how often do you guys change these out; miles/years?
Which part number do you like, or just anything
they have in stock at the auto parts store?
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It is a small filter about 1.5 to 2 inches long. It is in stock an almost any auto parts store and some Walmarts.
I use Wix filers but just about any brand will do in a pinch. I checked my local Walmart last night and they had it in stock (Fram brand). Bill said they could not find it at Walmart near Wausau. They does not surprise me as I could not find R-134 at Walmart in Oshkosh or Fondulac in July of this year. Different WalMarts are stocking different things these days.
The hole in the end of the filter (the inlet) goes toward the gas line.
The filter is your last line of defense in the fuel system before the carb.
I have not changed mine in years except for the incident with the rusty fuel line that I got from Denny Allen.
If I were to have a fuel starvation problem I would just replace it. They are less than $5.00 so why mess around with a questionable filter.
To blow through a questionable filter, simply put the open end up to you mouth and blow through it.
A little hint when changing the filter. Due to the bends in the line going to the carb it is sometimes difficult to get the gas line in the filter housing disconnected or reinstalled. If you have this problem, do not mess with it. Simply remove the 4 bolts holding the carb in position which will take less than one minute. Then move the carb around to match the line gas line.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: fuel filter questions [message #102893 is a reply to message #102811] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 21:15 |
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Ken is right about removing the 4 bolts to gain easy access to the fuel filter in the carb but one caution, when replacing the bolts DO NOT over tighten the 4 bolts - over tightening will warp the carb. Just a slight snug beyond finger tight is all that is needed.
Bill Brown - '77 Buckeye Cruiser
Coshocton OH
carguybill@sbcglobal.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions [message #102906 is a reply to message #102905] |
Wed, 13 October 2010 22:20 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Got it!
Loosening the end that attaches to the fuel pump doesn't help?
If you loosen the bolts that attach the carb to the manifold isn't it a good
idea to replace that gasket as it would have taken a set?
I know when I removed the Paterson QJ from the cast iron manifold to install
it on the Aluminum manifold I noted that the carb base had deeply imprinted
the 3/16" thick gasket Dick supplied.
When I had installed it on the cast iron manifold I torqued it as per the
Dick's instructions.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Hardie Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:13 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions
Robert Mueller wrote on Wed, 13 October 2010 22:55
> Now I'm confused! How does removing the four bolts that attach the
QuadraJet carb to the manifold provide easy access to the filter? <>
No hoo hoo mate, don't be confused:
Most of us have a hard line from the pump to the carb filter inlet. It is
difficult to align the steel line with the filter body, so by loosening the
bolts, you can move the carb around to more easily align it with the fuel
line.
"NOW they tell me . . ."
--
Hardie Johnson "Crashj"
1973 26 foot Glacier, White Thing
Raleigh NC
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions [message #102924 is a reply to message #102906] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 01:43 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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| Robert Mueller wrote on Wed, 13 October 2010 22:20 |
Got it!
Loosening the end that attaches to the fuel pump doesn't help?
If you loosen the bolts that attach the carb to the manifold isn't it a good
idea to replace that gasket as it would have taken a set?
I know when I removed the Paterson QJ from the cast iron manifold to install
it on the Aluminum manifold I noted that the carb base had deeply imprinted
the 3/16" thick gasket Dick supplied.
When I had installed it on the cast iron manifold I torqued it as per the
Dick's instructions.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Hardie Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 10:13 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions
Robert Mueller wrote on Wed, 13 October 2010 22:55
> Now I'm confused! How does removing the four bolts that attach the
QuadraJet carb to the manifold provide easy access to the filter? <>
No hoo hoo mate, don't be confused:
Most of us have a hard line from the pump to the carb filter inlet. It is
difficult to align the steel line with the filter body, so by loosening the
bolts, you can move the carb around to more easily align it with the fuel
line.
"NOW they tell me . . ."
--
Hardie Johnson "Crashj"
1973 26 foot Glacier, White Thing
Raleigh NC
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YOu are making more out of this than is necessary. Take the 4 bolts out and you can move the carb back or side to side to facilitate removing and reinstalling the line. The same carb is going back the same gasket. Who cares if it has taken a set. the same carb is going back in the same place. It took me more time to write this note than it does to take the 4 bolts out and move the carb.
As someone else stated here. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THE BOLTS on re-installation. You can warp the carb base easily by doing so. If you warp the base, the carb is junk.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions [message #102939 is a reply to message #102924] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 09:12 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Ken,
Not to argue with success but I was taught never to re-use gaskets or
o-rings.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ken Burton
Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2010 1:43 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions
YOu are making more out of this than is necessary. Take the 4 bolts out and
you can move the carb back or side to side to facilitate removing and
reinstalling the line. The same carb is going back the same gasket. Who
cares if it has taken a set. the same carb is going back in the same place.
It took me more time to write this note than it does to take the 4 bolts out
and move the carb.
As someone else stated here. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THE BOLTS on
re-installation. You can warp the carb base easily by doing so. If you warp
the base, the carb is junk.
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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GMCnet mailing list
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions [message #102990 is a reply to message #102924] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 19:01 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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| Ken Burton wrote on Thu, 14 October 2010 01:43 |
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You are making more out of this than is necessary. Take the 4 bolts out and you can move the carb back or side to side to facilitate removing and reinstalling the line. The same carb is going back the same gasket. Who cares if it has taken a set. the same carb is going back in the same place. It took me more time to write this note than it does to take the 4 bolts out and move the carb.
As someone else stated here. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THE BOLTS on re-installation. You can warp the carb base easily by doing so. If you warp the base, the carb is junk. [/quote]
Attached is an off-net note I received today from Dick Paterson on tightening the bolts:
Ken
I just caught your note about over tightening the carb bolts and you are right it will spoil a good carb. Not nitpicking but some folks will look at their carb base and it will be dead flat. They then assume that the carb is not warped and can be rebuilt. Just for clarification the base does not warp. The warp occurs between the bowl and cover (center section and upper section).
What happens is when the front bolts that pass through the bowl are over torqued the crossover heat peaks as in pulling a long grade and then backing off over the crest. The white metal bowl casting collapses or compresses with the heat/torque combo. Since the 2 front bolts also pass through the lid or upper section it has no choice but to follow the result of the bowl collapse beneath it.
You will see the warp from front corner to corner across the front of the carb at the parting line between bowl and lid You may have to fold the gasket up a bit to see it clearly. In many cases the bowl /lid will also be warped from the back of the carb to the front.
Some people think they can straighten these warp 'things' out. I have never had any success in having the crushed metal reversed to original.
Regards,
Dick
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions [message #103001 is a reply to message #102990] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 20:02 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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Netters, listen to Dick. He is 100 percent correct. White metal, aka pot
metal has a finite life and those pieces are no longer commonly available.
When they "take a set", it is fairly well impossible to restore it to
original shape. When quadrajet float bowls are warped as he describes, then
usually there is a vacuum leak there, or worst case there is a fuel leak. In
the bottom of the throttle body between the primary plates and secondary
plates is a cross head screw that if allowed to looosen will mimic the same
problem. If your carb is working well, try not to disturb it by loosening or
tightening the hold down bolts. One trick that I use to start a misaligned
fuel line is to use a fitting wrench of the correct size on the inlet
fitting and try to align the fitting with the filter housing while turning
it slightly. If it turns hard when you first start, stop and back up, you
are probably cross threaded. There is an aftermarket filter housing that
uses the shorter filter element and is enough shorter that it gives you more
room to work by the thermostat housing. Just what I do.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 Royale 403
On Thu, Oct 14, 2010 at 5:01 PM, Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
> Ken Burton wrote on Thu, 14 October 2010 01:43
> >
>
>
> You are making more out of this than is necessary. Take the 4 bolts out
> and you can move the carb back or side to side to facilitate removing and
> reinstalling the line. The same carb is going back the same gasket. Who
> cares if it has taken a set. the same carb is going back in the same place.
> It took me more time to write this note than it does to take the 4 bolts
> out and move the carb.
>
> As someone else stated here. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THE BOLTS on
> re-installation. You can warp the carb base easily by doing so. If you warp
> the base, the carb is junk. [/quote]
>
>
> Attached is an off-net note I received today from Dick Paterson on
> tightening the bolts:
>
> Ken
>
> I just caught your note about over tightening the carb bolts and you are
> right it will spoil a good carb. Not nitpicking but some folks will look at
> their carb base and it will be dead flat. They then assume that the carb is
> not warped and can be rebuilt. Just for clarification the base does not
> warp. The warp occurs between the bowl and cover (center section and upper
> section).
>
> What happens is when the front bolts that pass through the bowl are over
> torqued the crossover heat peaks as in pulling a long grade and then backing
> off over the crest. The white metal bowl casting collapses or compresses
> with the heat/torque combo. Since the 2 front bolts also pass through the
> lid or upper section it has no choice but to follow the result of the bowl
> collapse beneath it.
>
> You will see the warp from front corner to corner across the front of the
> carb at the parting line between bowl and lid You may have to fold the
> gasket up a bit to see it clearly. In many cases the bowl /lid will also be
> warped from the back of the carb to the front.
>
> Some people think they can straighten these warp 'things' out. I have
> never had any success in having the crushed metal reversed to original.
>
> Regards,
> Dick
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] fuel filter questions [message #103007 is a reply to message #102936] |
Thu, 14 October 2010 20:35 |
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Hardie Johnson
Messages: 483
Registered: January 2004
Location: Raleigh NC
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| mcolie wrote on Thu, 14 October 2010 09:46 |
My responses to the are carefully placed in the quoted text.
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| Robert Mueller wrote on Wed, 13 October 2010 23:20 |
>When I had installed it on the cast iron manifold I torqued it as per the Dick's instructions.
- That is because you can read and follow instructions - unlike many of the persons we might pay money to to work on the coach.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
quote and gasketed joint rank ends here
Matt
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Oh dear, that is exactly the problem, isn't it? I am not enthused about taking out and replacing the transmission my self, but I hate to pay some dummy professed professional mechanic for his misdirected work.
"I have never paid to get scru00ed"
Hardie Johnson "Crashj"
1973 26 foot Glacier, White Thing
Raleigh NC
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