Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #100625 is a reply to message #100609] |
Tue, 21 September 2010 23:26   |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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I'm considering them. the new Michelins are a little bit softer than the old pep boys whatever's. There is a guy with a set locally for $50, but we cannot seem to get together so I can look at them...
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #100644 is a reply to message #100624] |
Wed, 22 September 2010 08:45 |
 |
USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Dan,
Ditto! Except we don't have a towd.
HOWEVER, Double Trouble does have a COMPLETELY rebuilt front end with ALL
Dave Lenzi's parts including the modified upper control arms and I run 5
degrees (yes FIVE) degrees of caster, zero camber, zero toe in/out.
It tracks like it's on rails!
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Dan Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 11:55 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS
Steve, who's opinion do you want? Those who have them love them. I don't
have them and have no problems with wiggles, trucks passing, or rut wander.
Now, when I have the toad sometimes I get a little rut wander but it is
minimal. Spacers make the stance of the GMC look better.
Dan
--
Dan & Teri Gregg
http://danandteri.blogspot.com/
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #100832 is a reply to message #100664] |
Thu, 23 September 2010 21:58 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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On Wed, Sep 22, 2010 at 10:05 AM, J A Holland <acts238bishop@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> Chr$ wrote on Tue, 21 September 2010 23:26
>> I'm considering them. the new Michelins are a little bit softer than the old pep boys whatever's. There is a guy with a set locally for $50, but we cannot seem to get together so I can look at them...
>
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
> Chr$
> You hafta watch those bargains ~
> A fells sold me a $90.00 set of 2" lug centric ssacers ~
> It Was A fantastic Deal Until I Got Home ` {differevt thread pattern}~
> ~ Joe ~
> --
> Joe & Lavelle of ALEBAMY
>
> Previously owned a '65 6cyl Cortez, '68 8cyl Cortez, 1973 GMC 26' Canyonlands & Now a'78 Eleganza II 26' {"The Ole Gospel Ship"}
> _______________________________________________
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--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #100834 is a reply to message #100832] |
Thu, 23 September 2010 22:00 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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we have a policy of giving you full refund if your not satisfied with it\
You only pay the freight.
On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 7:58 PM, Jim Kanomata <jimkanomata@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 22, 2010 at 10:05 AM, J A Holland <acts238bishop@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Chr$ wrote on Tue, 21 September 2010 23:26
>>> I'm considering them. the new Michelins are a little bit softer than the old pep boys whatever's. There is a guy with a set locally for $50, but we cannot seem to get together so I can look at them...
>>
>>
>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>
>>
>> Chr$
>> You hafta watch those bargains ~
>> A fells sold me a $90.00 set of 2" lug centric ssacers ~
>> It Was A fantastic Deal Until I Got Home ` {differevt thread pattern}~
>> ~ Joe ~
>> --
>> Joe & Lavelle of ALEBAMY
>>
>> Previously owned a '65 6cyl Cortez, '68 8cyl Cortez, 1973 GMC 26' Canyonlands & Now a'78 Eleganza II 26' {"The Ole Gospel Ship"}
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
> http://www.appliedgmc.com
> 1-800-752-7502
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Spacers [message #191825 is a reply to message #100609] |
Fri, 30 November 2012 23:12 |
Gerald Wheeler
Messages: 152
Registered: February 2004
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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JimK sez:
> Bill's data confirms my thought that the 1 ton design has it's draw backs,
> and we have not been promoting it.
AND what are the drawbacks you speak of Jim?? We need input from all
sources to make our own decisions............
JR Wheeler NC/OR
> [Original Message]
> From: Jim Kanomata <jimkanomata@gmail.com>
> To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
> Date: 11/30/2012 11:42:46 PM
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Spacers
>
> Mac,
> There are several people that have traveled over100,000 miles with the 2"
> wheel spacers with great success
> The late Bobby Moore had over 120,000 miles on them and was a firm
believer
> that if the knuckle and bearing clearances are set properly, you'll not
> have problems. Unfortunately most do not know how to check them out and
> think they did it correctly.
> Bill's data confirms my thought that the 1 ton design has it's draw backs,
> and we have not been promoting it.
> Like Dave Lenzi, I feel that the stock front unit when set properly
> following Jerry's instruction is a safer approach.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 7:41 PM, Mickey Space Ship Shuttle
<mickeysss@me.com
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > If anyone needs a bearing puller set i just bought one, and if anyone in
> > the anaheim area needs to use it let me know.
> >
> > If anyone wants to do mine with it and knows how, i will pay you as
well.
> >
> > mickey
> >
> > 77 plam beach
> >
> > anaheim ca.
> >
> >
> >
> > On May 24, 2012, at 8:51 AM, Work Jerry wrote:
> >
> > > Good info, Adrien. It is important to note that all things pertaining
> > to steering geometry on our GMCs start with proper ride height. If a
coach
> > is not at the correct factory ride height front and rear, you cannot
> > achieve proper alignment. Things like the anti-dive geometry and proper
> > drive shaft angle to name just two are baked into the ride height and
> > cannot be altered. Caster, camber, toe and frame parallelism can be
> > adjusted even if the ride height is off but your coach still will not
drive
> > correctly and might wander with or without things like spacers and
> > aftermarket sway bars. The other critical factor is that the GMC was
> > designed for bias ply tires and the design was not changed (as far as I
can
> > tell) when they switched to radial ply tires in 76. Bias ply tires and
> > radial ply tires exhibit very different rolling characteristics. At
speed
> > a bias ply tire will go egg shaped and the contact patch area will shift
> > rearward which effectively increases the caster ang
> > le
> > > . Radial ply tires do not so additional caster must be dialed in at
> > rest to compensate. Too much caster, however, will cause excessive
> > steering effort and may overload the steering gear. You can read all
about
> > this in the slides from the presentation I gave at GMCWS Casa de Fruita
> > rally last month. The presentation slides in .pdf format are available
for
> > free download on the GMCWS web site or my web site
(http://jerrywork.com
> > ).
> > >
> > > Jerry
> > > Jerry Work
> > > Fine furniture designed and hand crafted in the 1907 former Masonic
> > Temple building in historic Kerby, OR
> > > glwork@mac.com
> > > http://jerrywork.com
> > > 541-592-5360
> > >
> > > -------------------------
> > > Message: 7
> > > Date: Wed, 23 May 2012 19:21:14 -0500
> > > From: Adrien Genesoto <fixman54@syix.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Spacers
> > > To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> > > Message-ID: <29ab1.4fbd7ef9@gmc.mybirdfeeder.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Mac,
> > >
> > > I know about the tracking differences that is built in to our coaches
> > (LOOKS, and rut tracking), but I Keep thinking about what spacers do to
the
> > designed 'front end geometry'.
> > >
> > > Not to mention the difference in load forces imposed on the hub
> > bearings. I'm surprised that they're lasting like they do.
> > >
> > > Here are some site about FEG also none as Steering Geometry.
> > >
> > >> http://www.scribd.com/doc/15355738/Steering-Geometry-Angles <
> > >
> > >>
http://www.motor.org.uk/documentlibrary/Sep%2009/TT%20_%20Sept%2009.pdf<
> > >
> > >>
> >
http://www.google.com/search?q=steering+geometry&hl=en&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&t
bo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=NXa9T5LtDsqliQKorZi5Dw&sqi=2&ved=0CGoQsAQ&biw=1600&
bih=688<
> > >
> > >
> > > Just for information.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > ”When we avoid the mistakes we might have made, we sometimes
make
> > the mistakes that we might have avoided.”
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Adrien & Jenny
> > > 75 Glenbrook
> > > Yuba City,Ca.
> > > -------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > GMCnet mailing list
> > > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
> http://www.appliedgmc.com
> 1-800-752-7502
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2634/5428 - Release Date: 11/30/12
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| Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Spacers [message #296691 is a reply to message #296677] |
Fri, 04 March 2016 09:16 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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If you want to introduce torque steer to a coach that doesn't have it, go
ahead and install some wheel spacers. All the GMC lacks is a bit more
horsepower to turn it into a real handful of ill handling beast,
particularly on moderately steep uphills with limited traction, like my
driveway and the street to Manny T's. Been there, done, that. It is why I
am very reluctant to install spacers wider than what is needed to clear
large brake calipers. But, what the heck, I think that America is still a
free country, spend your GMC dollars how you want.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Mar 3, 2016 11:01 PM, "Bob Dunahugh" wrote:
> With the front down in relationship to the rear. You have now adversely
> altered your caster. So I'd recommend getting the front back to the proper
> factory ride height. GM designed the front knuckle assembly to place the
> centerline of the two wheel bearing. To match the centerline of the tire.
> As this keeps the load equally on both bearings. You have how placed the
> major load over the outer wheel bearing. Thus you have created a load on a
> bearing that GM didn't design the assembly to handle. Yes, The bearings
> are large. But if the spacers are such a great idea for moving the wheels
> out to match the back. Don't you think GM would have designed the assembly
> that way in the first place. Most cars, and trucks built, don't have the
> front wheels aligned with the back wheels. So are all those designers
> wrong? Personally I'd never install wheel spacers on my GMC. But that's
> just my thought. Too many negative aspects for me.Bob Dunahugh78 Royale.
> _______________________________________________
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> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Spacers [message #296692 is a reply to message #296691] |
Fri, 04 March 2016 09:32 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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Here,here
There, there
$$,$$
😄
On Friday, March 4, 2016, James Hupy wrote:
> If you want to introduce torque steer to a coach that doesn't have it, go
> ahead and install some wheel spacers. All the GMC lacks is a bit more
> horsepower to turn it into a real handful of ill handling beast,
> particularly on moderately steep uphills with limited traction, like my
> driveway and the street to Manny T's. Been there, done, that. It is why I
> am very reluctant to install spacers wider than what is needed to clear
> large brake calipers. But, what the heck, I think that America is still a
> free country, spend your GMC dollars how you want.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, Or
> 78 GMC ROYALE 403
> On Mar 3, 2016 11:01 PM, "Bob Dunahugh" > wrote:
>
>> With the front down in relationship to the rear. You have now adversely
>> altered your caster. So I'd recommend getting the front back to the
> proper
>> factory ride height. GM designed the front knuckle assembly to place
> the
>> centerline of the two wheel bearing. To match the centerline of the tire.
>> As this keeps the load equally on both bearings. You have how placed the
>> major load over the outer wheel bearing. Thus you have created a load on
> a
>> bearing that GM didn't design the assembly to handle. Yes, The bearings
>> are large. But if the spacers are such a great idea for moving the wheels
>> out to match the back. Don't you think GM would have designed the
> assembly
>> that way in the first place. Most cars, and trucks built, don't have the
>> front wheels aligned with the back wheels. So are all those designers
>> wrong? Personally I'd never install wheel spacers on my GMC. But that's
>> just my thought. Too many negative aspects for me.Bob Dunahugh78 Royale.
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
> _______________________________________________
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--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
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Alternator Protection Cable
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| Re: [GMCnet] Wheel Spacers [message #296987 is a reply to message #296692] |
Wed, 09 March 2016 08:50 |
tphipps
Messages: 3005
Registered: August 2004
Location: Spanish Fort, AL
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Installing the 2" spacers will allow you to install the 80mm Calipers on the front if you are using OEM GM dually 16" Steel Rims.
Tom, Ms II
2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552
KA4CSG
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #297000 is a reply to message #100609] |
Wed, 09 March 2016 12:02 |
bwevers
Messages: 597
Registered: October 2010
Location: San Jose
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Everyone has opinions and preferences when it comes to wheel spacers.
They look good with the wider track and are required with the 1 TON conversion.
I notice a little torque steer when going uphill with full throttle on mine.
One question I have is if we use 17" wheels, do we still need the spacers?
I noticed that Manny's diesel coach had 17" alloy wheels.
Don't know if he had spacers on it.
Regards
Bill Wevers GMC49ers, GMC Western States
1975 Glenbrook - Manny Powerdrive, OneTon
455 F Block, G heads
San Jose
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #297002 is a reply to message #297000] |
Wed, 09 March 2016 13:01 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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GM 1 ton vehicles with 16" alloy or steel wheels from the factory are
equipped with cast iron or cast steel spacers that are identical to the
aluminum ones that Manny includes in his one ton conversion kits. His
aluminum spacers are fully machined instead of cast, and are a whole bunch
lighter than the factory ones. The geometry with the spacers is correct as
he can make it when fitted to the GMC coach. If it were me, I wouldn't mess
too much with the way he produces the kit.
Yes, if the ride height and alignment is not spot on, SOME, BUT NOT
ALL coaches will experience a bit of torque steer, particularly when
negotiating steep uphill grades. Front to rear weight distribution, as well
as more powerful engines will sometimes affect torque steer also. But, for
that matter, I have a customer with a completely rebuilt to factory specs
with the good adjustable pitman arm, new steering box and relay arm. It
has a very powerful 455 with EFI and it torque steers quite noticeably on
steep uphills like my driveway, particularly when it is wet. It is the
nature of most front drive vehicles to exhibit some torque steer. I have a
PT Dream Cruiser with the HIgh Output Turbocharged and intercooled engine.
Without traction control turned on on wet pavement and only a slight bit of
turn, if you use too much throttle, you will have a real handfull of front
wheel drive car really quick. Turbo SAAB automobiles, and MIni Coopers from
the 60's as well as VW GTI Rabbits all exhibit similar charactistics. Most
American Cars are too heavy on the front end to do much of it, but there
are some that do. I have noticed that when GMC coaches have nearly full
holding and fresh water tanks, they are a bit worse too. Your experiences
may vary.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403
On Wed, Mar 9, 2016 at 10:02 AM, Bill Wevers wrote:
> Everyone has opinions and preferences when it comes to wheel spacers.
> They look good with the wider track and are required with the 1 TON
> conversion.
> I notice a little torque steer when going uphill with full throttle on
> mine.
>
> One question I have is if we use 17" wheels, do we still need the spacers?
> I noticed that Manny's diesel coach had 17" alloy wheels.
> Don't know if he had spacers on it.
>
> Regards
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS [message #297005 is a reply to message #297002] |
Wed, 09 March 2016 13:20 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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My '81 Chevy Citation X-11 definitely had power torque steer
as did my '85 Buick Skyhawk T-Type Turbo Coupe.
Not a bad problem if you were ready for it!
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ Since 30 November '53 ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ Member GMCMI and Classics ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ~ TZE166V101966 ~ ~ ~ ~
~ ~ ~ '76 ex-Palm Beach ~ ~ ~
~~ k2gkk + hotmail dot com ~~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
______________
|[ ]~~~[][ ][]\
"--OO--[]---O-"
> Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2016 11:01:45 -0800
> From: jamesh1296@gmail.com
> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] WHEEL SPACERS
>
> GM 1 ton vehicles with 16" alloy or steel wheels from the factory are
> equipped with cast iron or cast steel spacers that are identical to the
> aluminum ones that Manny includes in his one ton conversion kits. His
> aluminum spacers are fully machined instead of cast, and are a whole bunch
> lighter than the factory ones. The geometry with the spacers is correct as
> he can make it when fitted to the GMC coach. If it were me, I wouldn't mess
> too much with the way he produces the kit.
> Yes, if the ride height and alignment is not spot on, SOME, BUT NOT
> ALL coaches will experience a bit of torque steer, particularly when
> negotiating steep uphill grades. Front to rear weight distribution, as well
> as more powerful engines will sometimes affect torque steer also. But, for
> that matter, I have a customer with a completely rebuilt to factory specs
> with the good adjustable pitman arm, new steering box and relay arm. It
> has a very powerful 455 with EFI and it torque steers quite noticeably on
> steep uphills like my driveway, particularly when it is wet. It is the
> nature of most front drive vehicles to exhibit some torque steer. I have a
> PT Dream Cruiser with the HIgh Output Turbocharged and intercooled engine.
> Without traction control turned on on wet pavement and only a slight bit of
> turn, if you use too much throttle, you will have a real handfull of front
> wheel drive car really quick. Turbo SAAB automobiles, and MIni Coopers from
> the 60's as well as VW GTI Rabbits all exhibit similar charactistics. Most
> American Cars are too heavy on the front end to do much of it, but there
> are some that do. I have noticed that when GMC coaches have nearly full
> holding and fresh water tanks, they are a bit worse too. Your experiences
> may vary.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, OR
> 78 GMC Royale 403
>
> On Wed, Mar 9, 2016 at 10:02 AM, Bill Wevers wrote:
>
>> Everyone has opinions and preferences when it comes to wheel spacers.
>> They look good with the wider track and are required with the 1 TON
>> conversion.
>> I notice a little torque steer when going uphill with full throttle on
>> mine.
>>
>> One question I have is if we use 17" wheels, do we still need the spacers?
>> I noticed that Manny's diesel coach had 17" alloy wheels.
>> Don't know if he had spacers on it.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
_______________________________________________
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