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Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368624]

Mon, 31 January 2022 12:00

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Guys,

What are your thoughts on remote master cylinder reservoirs?

Thanks,
Tom K.

Tom & Oki Katzenberger, Kingsville, Maryland, 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark Control, Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee Ignition

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368625 is a reply to message #368624]

Mon, 31 January 2022 12:02

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Just trying to increase capacity on the 2 stage MC.

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368635 is a reply to message #368625]

Wed, 02 February 2022 09:52

Bullitthead

Messages: 1411
Registered: November 2013

Karma: 5

Senior Member

If you are successful at sealing the M/C with the diaphragm gasket, (it's going to seep), remember you will need a similar gasket on your reservoir to avoid a vacuum but still keep air out.

Terry Kelpien ASE Master Technician 73 Glacier 260 Smithfield, Va.

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368636 is a reply to message #368624]

Wed, 02 February 2022 12:37

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Terry,

Yes, I agree. I was thinking more on the lines of machining fittings into the MC in lieu of the existing reservoirs. This way we would have remote reservoir feed directly into the master cylinder.

Take care,
Tom K.

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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368637 is a reply to message #368636]

Wed, 02 February 2022 12:54

James Hupy

Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010

Karma: -62

Senior Member

There are a number of OEM remote fill master cylinders out there. I had a
vehicle in the past that had a remote fill, if memory serves me correctly,
it was a Ford Bronco II.
Perhaps one of those might work without much fiddling around. Just an
idea I'm throwing out there.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022, 10:37 AM wrote:

> Terry,
>
> Yes, I agree. I was thinking more on the lines of machining fittings into
> the MC in lieu of the existing reservoirs. This way we would have remote
> reservoir feed directly into the master cylinder.
>
> Take care,
> Tom K.
> --
> Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
> Kingsville, Maryland,
> 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark Control,
> Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee
> Ignition
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368638 is a reply to message #368637]

Wed, 02 February 2022 14:02

Keith V

Messages: 2337
Registered: March 2008
Location: Mounds View,MN

Karma: 0

Senior Member

I don't get where you'd mount a remote reservoir usually they are mounted above the NC and we have no room
________________________________
From: James Hupy
Sent: Wednesday, February 2, 2022 12:54 PM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior

There are a number of OEM remote fill master cylinders out there. I had a
vehicle in the past that had a remote fill, if memory serves me correctly,
it was a Ford Bronco II.
Perhaps one of those might work without much fiddling around. Just an
idea I'm throwing out there.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022, 10:37 AM wrote:

> Terry,
>
> Yes, I agree. I was thinking more on the lines of machining fittings into
> the MC in lieu of the existing reservoirs. This way we would have remote
> reservoir feed directly into the master cylinder.
>
> Take care,
> Tom K.
> --
> Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
> Kingsville, Maryland,
> 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark Control,
> Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee
> Ignition
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com

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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368639 is a reply to message #368624]

Wed, 02 February 2022 14:07

James Hupy

Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010

Karma: -62

Senior Member

My suggestion was for those who were concerned with increased volume of
brake fluid. Locating the remote was not one of my considerations. I admit
that it might be problematic to find a location under the hatch that is
both higher than the one on the booster and still accessible for filling.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022, 12:02 PM Keith V wrote:

> I don't get where you'd mount a remote reservoir usually they are mounted
> above the NC and we have no room
> ________________________________
> From: James Hupy
> Sent: Wednesday, February 2, 2022 12:54 PM
> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
> Subject: [GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior
>
> There are a number of OEM remote fill master cylinders out there. I had a
> vehicle in the past that had a remote fill, if memory serves me correctly,
> it was a Ford Bronco II.
> Perhaps one of those might work without much fiddling around. Just an
> idea I'm throwing out there.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, Oregon
>
> On Wed, Feb 2, 2022, 10:37 AM wrote:
>
>> Terry,
>>
>> Yes, I agree. I was thinking more on the lines of machining fittings into
>> the MC in lieu of the existing reservoirs. This way we would have remote
>> reservoir feed directly into the master cylinder.
>>
>> Take care,
>> Tom K.
>> --
>> Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
>> Kingsville, Maryland,
>> 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark
> Control,
>> Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee
>> Ignition
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368640 is a reply to message #368624]

Wed, 02 February 2022 15:15

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Jim and Keith,

I was just throwing the thought out there and haven't gone beyond that. The original master cylinder fill height was fine. To get that level again may be achievable. I have been concentrating on the interior wood work lately.

I took out the oven and am installing a Convection/ Microwave/Air fryer and am also in the process cutting out for a 7 Cu. Ft. 3 way Norcold.

Monday the coach goes away for 2 weeks so while I was getting the brakes ready for transport and to allow the paint shop to move the coach about. As I was doing so, I was thinking about possibilities down the road, but haven't gone much beyond the thought.

I do agree with you both in regards to the elevation and more. I still have much to think about with regard to the brakes.

Take care,
Tom K.

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Re: [GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368643 is a reply to message #368637]

Thu, 03 February 2022 10:53

Bullitthead

Messages: 1411
Registered: November 2013

Karma: 5

Senior Member

The Bronco II has a remote reservoir for the clutch master cylinder. It holds about 3 tablespoons of fluid and then splooges half that out when you put in the diaphragm. Very small system and just barely enough accommodation for wear of the clutch disk. And no extra throw or amplification in case of an air bubble, as the system works the opposite way to increase leverage.

Terry Kelpien ASE Master Technician 73 Glacier 260 Smithfield, Va.

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368645 is a reply to message #368624]

Thu, 03 February 2022 18:40

Larry

Messages: 2875
Registered: January 2004
Location: Menomonie, WI

Karma: 10

Senior Member

Why are you considering a remote reservoir? Just check it often and kept full. JWIT

Larry

78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.

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Re: [GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Reservoir [message #368646 is a reply to message #368643]

Thu, 03 February 2022 20:10

78 Barbi

Messages: 80
Registered: August 2004
Location: Tiverton, Ontario , Canad...

Karma: -1

Member

Have installed a couple of these on OEM master cylinders , the one in the photo link is from Pegasus Auto Racing and is 8 oz. and is too big and cumbersome , even a 6 oz. is a bit too large . A 4 or 5 oz. would be sufficient . The hose is made especially for brake fluid and is a MUST ! Very few materials can withstand brake fluid for long . http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/mechanical/p68423-raybestos-mc39434-master-cylinder-with-remote-reservoir.html

Cheers.....Albert
78 Barbi The 23' Birchaven

[Updated on: Thu, 03 February 2022 20:11]

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368647 is a reply to message #368624]

Fri, 04 February 2022 09:28

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Even at the same elevation, but where the lid is more accessible is better; and see thru reservoir is even better yet.

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368648 is a reply to message #368624]

Sat, 05 February 2022 22:13

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Guys,

Just thinking out loud to many of you other thinkers, if there was a master cylinder for 6 wheel disk brakes which would perform much better or as desired, but would not fit due to too large a reservoir? If so, one could possibly reduce the reservoir height (if metal), make a semi permanent cover and make the balance of the reservoir remote.

Simply, not re-engineer a Master Cylinder, just modify the reservoir or move it to fit.

Is there such a Master Cylinder which is best or better, but is just too high?

Thanks,
Tom K.

[Updated on: Sat, 05 February 2022 22:13]

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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368649 is a reply to message #368648]

Sun, 06 February 2022 00:05

James Hupy

Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010

Karma: -62

Senior Member

There are at least 3 different reservoirs available for the P-30. The
reservoirs bolt on to the actual master cylinder. They are not cast iron,
and perhaps could be modified to fit. The P-30 is not my favorite cylinder
for the brakes you describe. They do not develop as much line pressure as
the OEM does.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Sat, Feb 5, 2022, 8:14 PM wrote:

>
> Just thinking out loud to many of you other thinkers, if there was a
> master cylinder for 6 wheel disk brakes which would perform much better or
> as
> desired, but would not fit due to too large a reservoir? If so, one could
> possibly reduce the reservoir height (if metal), make a semi permanent cover
> and make the balance of the reservoir remote.
>
> Simply, not re-engineer a Master Cylinder, just modify the reservoir or
> move it to fit.
>
> Is there such a Master Cylinder which is best or better, but is just too
> high?
>
> Thanks,
> Tom K.
> --
> Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
> Kingsville, Maryland,
> 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark Control,
> Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee
> Ignition
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:

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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Reservoir [message #368658 is a reply to message #368646]

Sun, 06 February 2022 11:51

bdub

Messages: 1578
Registered: February 2004
Location: Central Texas

Karma: 5

Senior Member

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/mechanical/p68423-raybestos-mc39434-master
-cylinder-with-remote-reservoir.html

-----Original Message-----
From: Albert&Sheila Branscombe via Gmclist [mailto:gmclist@list.gmcnet.org]
Subject: [GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Reservoir

Have installed a couple of these on OEM master cylinders , the one in the
photo link is from Pegasus Auto Racing and is 8 oz. and is too big and
cumbersome , even a 6 oz. is a bit too large . A 4 or 5 oz. would be
sufficient . The hose is made especially for brake fluid and is a MUST !
Very
few materials can withstand brake fluid for long .

Cheers.....Albert
78 Barbi The 23' Birchaven
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bdub
'76 Palm Beach/Central Texas
www.bdub.net
www.gmcmhphotos.com
www.gmcmotorhomemarketplace.com
www.gmcmhregistry.com
www.facebook.com/groups/classicgmcmotorhomes
www.facebook.com/groups/gmcmm

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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368660 is a reply to message #368648]

Sun, 06 February 2022 12:39

wally

Messages: 643
Registered: August 2004
Location: Omaha Nebraska

Karma: 5

Senior Member

Tom Katzenberger wrote on Sat, 05 February 2022 22:13

Guys,

Just thinking out loud to many of you other thinkers, if there was a master cylinder for 6 wheel disk brakes which would perform much better or as desired, but would not fit due to too large a reservoir? If so, one could possibly reduce the reservoir height (if metal), make a semi permanent cover and make the balance of the reservoir remote.

Simply, not re-engineer a Master Cylinder, just modify the reservoir or move it to fit.

Is there such a Master Cylinder which is best or better, but is just too high?

Thanks,
Tom K.

We had these fitted and a picture of Bob Stone's 1332 project
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g7378-40-mm-master-reservoirs.html

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g7378-40-mm-master-reservoirs.html

Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook

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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368664 is a reply to message #368660]

Sun, 06 February 2022 15:14

GMCWiperMan

Messages: 1248
Registered: December 2007

Karma: 1

Senior Member

Wally,

Thanks for the picture of Bob's 1332 project. He's told me about it so I
had an idea of what he's done, but hadn't actually seen it yet. When you
talk to him, ask if he considered a master-slave hydraulic linkage rather
than all that mechanical paraphernalia. I remember looking at an old Dodge
dump truck with a Hydroboost located on the frame below the cab. At the
firewall there was a simple single-piston master cylinder; that was plumbed
to a simple single-piston slave cylinder whose output drove the
Hydroboost. Simple and effective and VERY easy to design and build.
Should work well for us and never develop play like the mechanical linkage
will. I haven't looked for the master-slave hydraulics, but it should be
readily available.

Ken H.

On Sun, Feb 6, 2022 at 1:40 PM Wally Anderson wrote:

> Tom Katzenberger wrote on Sat, 05 February 2022 22:13
>> Guys,
>>
>> Just thinking out loud to many of you other thinkers, if there was a
> master cylinder for 6 wheel disk brakes which would perform much better or
> as
>> desired, but would not fit due to too large a reservoir? If so, one
> could possibly reduce the reservoir height (if metal), make a semi permanent
>> cover and make the balance of the reservoir remote.
>>
>> Simply, not re-engineer a Master Cylinder, just modify the reservoir or
> move it to fit.
>>
>> Is there such a Master Cylinder which is best or better, but is just too
> high?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Tom K.
>
> We had these fitted and a picture of Bob Stone's 1332 project
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g7378-40-mm-master-reservoirs.html
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g7378-40-mm-master-reservoirs.html
> --
> Wally Anderson
> Omaha NE
> 75 Glenbrook
> Megasquirt EFI Onan & 455
> Bosch Hydromax
> Manny reaction arm system
> Kelsey Hayes park brake
> http://wallyandsue.blogspot.com/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
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Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368665 is a reply to message #368624]

Sun, 06 February 2022 15:48

Tom Katzenberger

Messages: 399
Registered: June 2019
Location: Kingsville, MD

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Wow Ken,

That is genius! A clutch master and slave housed in a steel cage/box in front of a 2 stage brake master cylinder. I can be remotely placed anywhere. Do you boost before the clutch master or fab a mount for a brake booster and master cylinder?

Very good thought guys.

Take care,
Tom K.

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Re: [GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368669 is a reply to message #368664]

Sun, 06 February 2022 16:51

wally

Messages: 643
Registered: August 2004
Location: Omaha Nebraska

Karma: 5

Senior Member

GMCWiperMan wrote on Sun, 06 February 2022 15:14

Wally,

Thanks for the picture of Bob's 1332 project. He's told me about it so I
had an idea of what he's done, but hadn't actually seen it yet. When you
talk to him, ask if he considered a master-slave hydraulic linkage rather
than all that mechanical paraphernalia. I remember looking at an old Dodge
dump truck with a Hydroboost located on the frame below the cab. At the
firewall there was a simple single-piston master cylinder; that was plumbed
to a simple single-piston slave cylinder whose output drove the
Hydroboost. Simple and effective and VERY easy to design and build.
Should work well for us and never develop play like the mechanical linkage
will. I haven't looked for the master-slave hydraulics, but it should be
readily available.

Ken H.

On Sun, Feb 6, 2022 at 1:40 PM Wally Anderson wrote:

> Tom Katzenberger wrote on Sat, 05 February 2022 22:13
>> Guys,
>>
>> Just thinking out loud to many of you other thinkers, if there was a
> master cylinder for 6 wheel disk brakes which would perform much better or
> as
>> desired, but would not fit due to too large a reservoir? If so, one
> could possibly reduce the reservoir height (if metal), make a semi permanent
>> cover and make the balance of the reservoir remote.
>>
>> Simply, not re-engineer a Master Cylinder, just modify the reservoir or
> move it to fit.
>>
>> Is there such a Master Cylinder which is best or better, but is just too
> high?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Tom K.
>
> We had these fitted and a picture of Bob Stone's 1332 project
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g7378-40-mm-master-reservoirs.html
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g7378-40-mm-master-reservoirs.html
> --
> Wally Anderson
> Omaha NE
> 75 Glenbrook
> Megasquirt EFI Onan & 455
> Bosch Hydromax
> Manny reaction arm system
> Kelsey Hayes park brake
> http://wallyandsue.blogspot.com/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
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Stone did consider a remote hydraulic actuated system and there are several available from others already. Hal StClair is looking at it too for his FMC, yes thats FMC not GMC. Stone has a couple 1332's out there.
https://www.tdsideas.com/store/p1/Remote_Hydroboost_Mounting_Kit.html
https://bustedknuckleoffroad.com/products/remote-mount-hydroboost-brake-kit
https://www.vancopbs.com/product_p/urs.htm

Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook

[Updated on: Sun, 06 February 2022 17:01]

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[GMCnet] Re: Remote Master Cylinder Resvior [message #368670 is a reply to message #368665]

Sun, 06 February 2022 16:51

GMCWiperMan

Messages: 1248
Registered: December 2007

Karma: 1

Senior Member

I'd check out something like this for the Master/Slave system:
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/jeep,2002,wrangler,4.0l+l6,1386873,transmission-manual,clutch+master+&+slave+cylinder+assembly,10290

The boost should definitely be at the slave end, IMHO. The clutch M/S
setup doesn't have to be as robust as a brake system, so I'd be leery of
asking it to take the full un-boosted stress.

JMHO,

Ken H.

On Sun, Feb 6, 2022 at 4:48 PM wrote:

> Wow Ken,
>
> That is genius! A clutch master and slave housed in a steel cage/box in
> front of a 2 stage brake master cylinder. I can be remotely placed anywhere.
> Do you boost before the clutch master or fab a mount for a brake booster
> and master cylinder?
>
> Very good thought guys.
>
> Take care,
> Tom K.
> --
> Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
> Kingsville, Maryland,
> 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark Control,
> Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee
> Ignition
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>
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