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Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325473] Fri, 27 October 2017 09:07 Go to next message
Ray Erspamer is currently offline  Ray Erspamer   United States
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
Senior Member
Good Morning

I will be picking up my rebuilt engine next week. I've been researching "Engine Break'In Procedures" for rebuilt engines and the recommendations are all over the map, kind of like discussions/recommendations on engine oil.

I'd be interested in hearing what members of the group think would be the best break-in procedure.

Thanks

Ray


Ray Erspamer 78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen 403, 3.70 Final Drive Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System, Holley Hyperspark Ignition System 414-484-9431
Re: Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325474 is a reply to message #325473] Fri, 27 October 2017 09:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
C Boyd is currently offline  C Boyd   United States
Messages: 2629
Registered: April 2006
Karma: 18
Senior Member
I would highly recommend installing the engine on a run in stand and break in the cam and tune engine and check for leaks before installing engine in your coach. At least a 30 minute initial run in then 24 hour cool time and then at least 2 more run in sessions.





Ray Erspamer wrote on Fri, 27 October 2017 10:07
Good Morning

I will be picking up my rebuilt engine next week. I've been researching "Engine Break'In Procedures" for rebuilt engines and the recommendations are all over the map, kind of like discussions/recommendations on engine oil.

I'd be interested in hearing what members of the group think would be the best break-in procedure.

Thanks

Ray



C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
Re: Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325475 is a reply to message #325473] Fri, 27 October 2017 09:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jhbridges is currently offline  jhbridges   United States
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
Senior Member
What Chuck said - if you have a run - in stand. If not, I'd do the same in the coach in P or N and then jack and block after each run so you can get under it and leak check. Who built the engine? (Out of curiosity)

--johnny


Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons. Braselton, Ga. I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
Re: [GMCnet] Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325480 is a reply to message #325473] Fri, 27 October 2017 10:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
USAussie is currently offline  USAussie   United States
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
Senior Member
Ray,

Call Dick Paterson (705) 325-4554 and he'll tell you EXACTLY what to do, he's forgotten more about rebuilding engines than "we"
know! :-)

Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
USA '77 Kingsley - TZE 267V100808

-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ray Erspamer
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2017 9:07 AM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure

Good Morning

I will be picking up my rebuilt engine next week. I've been researching "Engine Break'In Procedures" for rebuilt engines and the
recommendations are all over the map, kind of like discussions/recommendations on engine oil.

I'd be interested in hearing what members of the group think would be the best break-in procedure.

Thanks

Ray


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Regards, Rob M. (USAussie) The Pedantic Mechanic Sydney, Australia '75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428 '75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
Re: Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325481 is a reply to message #325473] Fri, 27 October 2017 10:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ken Burton is currently offline  Ken Burton   United States
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
Senior Member
Our local rebuilder does the initial break-in before we pick up the engine. In the case of the Olds 455 it comes already full of Rotella 15W40 non-synthetic T4 with added GM EOS and a Wix filter. Instructions are to install it and go drive it at various speeds for the first 500 miles.

Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
Re: [GMCnet] Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325483 is a reply to message #325473] Fri, 27 October 2017 10:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bdub is currently offline  bdub   United States
Messages: 1578
Registered: February 2004
Location: Central Texas
Karma: 5
Senior Member

Dick Paterson says:
If you are replacing a blown motor, then you must understand that the oil
cooler in the radiator and it’s connecting oil lines will have metal debris
in them. That debris must be cleaned out. I mean “hospital clean”. Take the
lines and radiator to a radiator shop for this. Unless this step is done, I
give the new motor maybe 200 miles and BANG, the rods and mains will be out
of it.
There are many opinions on starting procedures and in the following text, I
am simply outlining how we do it here at Springfield Ignition.
It has been known forever that the first 20 minutes from start up on a
rebuild are the life or death factor in initial camshaft survival. With
today’s motor oils, that now have minimal anti-wear additives (ZDDP Zinc /
Phosphorous), the start up process is most critical; becoming the single
factor between a 30 minute cam/lifter failure, and any anticipated motor
service life.
During the motor build, the builder coats the camshaft lobes and lifter
bases with a special lube, (if he’s sharp he will do the same to the rocker
arm ends and fulcrum). This special lube will cling or stay on those parts
until the motor is started, provided it is not spun over in the interim.
After the motor is fired, the only lube the cam lobe and lifter foot get is
from oil splash (there is no pressure lube to those contact points. This is
the reason that the motor speed must be brought up to 2000 rpm then slowly
cycled through 2000-2500 for the first 20 minutes of run time. There is
insufficient oil spray at idle or low rpm to supply enough oil to save the
cam.
Now here is the important point; anything that can cause a motor to be shut
down during this start phase will surely impact the cam/lifter run-in. If
you do your homework before you fire the motor, you will reduce the chances
of having to shut down. We have the letters S O - V F W written large on the
wall beside the run in test stand, and on its instrument panel. If the motor
is still in the coach, write them on a piece of masking tape and stick it
where you see it. Our rule is that these letters must be gone though twice,
‘no exceptions’, because the motor must fire right away, like a modern fuel
injected motor, with the first turns of the starter. This is our letter
check for a carbureted only motor;
(S) SPARK - You have to be able to see it. We always finish assemble the
motor at TDC #1. (Number one spark plug at Top Dead Center) You will need to
verify yours. Find and mark the slot in the balancer with white out then
with a ½ inch breaker bar on the harmonic balancer center bolt, have some
one hold their finger in the #1 spark plug hole. As you rotate the motor
there will be air pressure at the plug hole as the piston approaches TDC.
Line the mark under the timing tab at about 10 degrees. If you don’t do the
‘finger pressure test’, then the slot could be under the timing tab, but the
motor will be on TDC #6. This is called ‘half out of time’ and will cause
backfire or sneeze and wont start. It is crucial that the lube paste not be
wiped off the cam. The motor must be left undisturbed at TDC #1 until you go
through all the letters. Next step, use a test light and check for spark
‘with key on’ at the coil positive (+) terminal or BATT pink wire to the HEI
distributor.
(O) OIL - We fill the sump with 15w-40 Shell Rotella T (regular HD
gas/diesel oil) and add a container of GM ‘EOS’. If you’re not sure what
your motor builder did, take the rocker covers off (before you have the A/C
brackets on) and pour some of the oil and EOS on the rockers and valve stem
ends. Leave the rocker covers off until you pre lube the motor later.
(V) VACUUM - Verify that all vacuum ports into the intake manifold and the
carb base are attached or capped off. Any big vacuum leak will cause you to
shut the motor down. We attach our vacuum gauge to a manifold source.
(F) FUEL - You should have fresh gas, especially if the vehicle has been
sitting for any length of time without STA-BIL in the fuel. If you do not
have an electric pump, then carefully fill the carb bowl through its top
vents, not by spinning the motor over. Go over all the fuel line connections
for tightness. Fuel leaks are a major cause of fires!
(W) WATER - Filling the radiator is always a slow chore, due to the air
locks created in the block. Take the heater hose connection at the back of
the intake manifold off (above #8 cyl) and fill until you see water
here. Now go over each hose clamp on the water pump and rad. A tight motor
is going to create a lot of heat and any cause for a boil over will mean a
shut down.
Now we go back through our letters for the second time.
It is now time to pre-lube the motor. We put our homemade (from a cobbled
distributor base) tool down into the distributor hole to engage the oil pump
drive shaft. Spin it backwards with an air wrench or good 3/8 drill until
you see oil pressure on the gauge and oil at the rocker arms; this could
take 5 minutes or more. Drop the distributor into the motor, pointing the
vacuum can back at the firewall, set the dist. cap on loose (without plug
wires on it), now, peeking under the cap, rotate the dist. base until the
rotor tip points at a plug wire tab inside the cap. Tighten the dist. hold
down clamp. That plug wire tower has now become #1 cyl and after you put
that plug wire on, install the plug wires following the firing order counter
clockwise around the cap. Then verify the firing order twice. (1 8 4 3 6 5 7
2) Any crossed wires could cause a backfire. Now is the best time to hook up
your timing light, keeping the wires away from belts exhaust manifolds,
etc..
The motor is now ready to start. We make sure we know where the fire
extinguishers are and have additional radiator water on hand. Turn up the
idle speed screw on the carburetor linkage. Look into the front ½ of the
carb and move the throttle, watching for a squirt of fuel. Turn the key,
pump the throttle, and the motor should start on its first revolutions. IF
IT DOES NOT, then something is wrong and you need to go back through the
letters ( S ) SPARK and ( F ) FUEL. Above all, DO NOT continue spinning the
motor and wiping all the assembly lube off the cam. If the motor is fuel
injected, then you must work your way through the spark and fuel maps to
verify all the sensor current parameters.
Once it fires, hold the RPM up to 2000 and verify the timing is about 15-20
degrees. Then begin to gradually cycle the rpm up through 2500 and back to
2000 for at least the next 20 minutes, keeping an eye on the water temp and
oil pressure, and of course, any fluid (or vacuum) leaks. Never let it idle
during this first run as there is insufficient oil splash at idle to save
the cam.
We now shut it down and let it cool off completely. This takes 3 or 4 hours
and allows the valve springs to go cold and take their ‘set’.
We use a “FILTERMAG” on every motor so we leave the break in oil for the
next 2 ½ hours, you may want to change just the filter then, to get rid of
as much internal trash as possible. The best way to complete your run in is
to drive the coach, putting the motor under load. The break in oil should be
left in for at least 1500 miles, topping it up as necessary. Thereafter you
can select a motor oil of your choice. (Our choice is always a synthetic!)
This break in procedure will give your motor the best chance to deliver a
long service life.

Dick Paterson’s Springfield Ignition
705-325-4554 dick@paterson-gmc.com
www.paterson-gmc.com
GMC Engines Transmissions Carburators
Distruibuters Ignition Wire Sets

bdub


-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist On Behalf Of Ray Erspamer
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2017 9:07 AM
Subject: [GMCnet] Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure

I'd be interested in hearing what members of the group think would be the
best break-in procedure.


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bdub
'76 Palm Beach/Central Texas
www.bdub.net
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Re: [GMCnet] Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325484 is a reply to message #325480] Fri, 27 October 2017 11:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
James Hupy is currently offline  James Hupy   United States
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
Senior Member
This is what I do with newly rebuilt engines that have new rebores and new
pistons fitted, along with camshafts, lifters, valve guides and valve
stems, timing chain and sprockets, rod and main bearings and reground or
polished crankshaft along with new oil pump. Everything inside that engine
that rubs, rolls, or reciprocates against new parts needs to scuff in to a
compatible wearing surface. Lots of fine and some not so fine metal parts
get rubbed off in the process, and if they end up in the wrong place, can
do a great deal of damage. So, knowing that, don't do anything that creates
a huge amount of friction or heat until those parts scuff in to each other.
How long that takes is subject to discussion. Some subscribe to the, "Drive
it like you stole it theory", and some to the "Treat it like it is going to
break any second, now". I defer to my education and experience over many
years of doing this stuff. It all starts long before you hit the starter
for the first time. You have to have start up lubrication on every wear
surface in the engine before you start it. When the cam and lifters and cam
bearings are installed, the cam manufacturer has some very specific
instructions about the lubricants to be used. So do the piston and ring
manufacturers. I use cam lubes, Lucas Oil assembly lube, vasoline in the
oil pump gears, and because S and J provides it with each rebuilt engine
that I install, Joe Gibbs Racing Oil in the pan. S and J installs their
engines in a test facility with a large electric motor that turns the
engine over. It is called a Simtest Machine. By turning the engine they can
measure the amperage draw on a newly rebuilt engine to tell how tight it
is. It does not expand the rings in the bores, or load the piston tops like
combustion pressure does, so it is not an actual break in. I am NOT A FAN
of breaking a new engine in on a Dyno. They have their purposes, but I
prefer to break an engine in the way that it will be used in service.
Always, always have the ignition timing exactly set before you start a new
engine, and if possible, prelube the oil system either with the oil pump or
a pressure vessel attached to the gallery. Always have the radiator filled
as well. Exhaust system connected. If you are going to run headers, and you
have a fancy set of them with ceramic coating, wait until after you break
in the cam and lifters before you install them or you will burn the coating
off of them. They often get red hot during this phase of the break in.
After following the camshaft manufacturers specific instructions, let the
engine cool overnight and retorque manifolds. Then drive it, using short
bursts of heavy throttle followed by "balloon footing' it to allow cooling.
Do not drive with the cruise control for the first 10,000 miles. (my
personal dislike). Avoid prolonged periods of wide open throttle for the
first 10,000 miles. You should be good for many years with a good break in.
Change the break in oil at 100 miles or so. Use the oil of your choice, and
don't switch brands.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403

On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 8:03 AM, Rob Mueller
wrote:

> Ray,
>
> Call Dick Paterson (705) 325-4554 and he'll tell you EXACTLY what to do,
> he's forgotten more about rebuilding engines than "we"
> know! :-)
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> The Pedantic Mechanic
> Sydney, Australia
> AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
> USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
> USA '77 Kingsley - TZE 267V100808
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ray
> Erspamer
> Sent: Friday, October 27, 2017 9:07 AM
> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
> Subject: [GMCnet] Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure
>
> Good Morning
>
> I will be picking up my rebuilt engine next week. I've been researching
> "Engine Break'In Procedures" for rebuilt engines and the
> recommendations are all over the map, kind of like
> discussions/recommendations on engine oil.
>
> I'd be interested in hearing what members of the group think would be the
> best break-in procedure.
>
> Thanks
>
> Ray
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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Re: Rebuilt Engine Break-In Procedure [message #325485 is a reply to message #325475] Fri, 27 October 2017 12:05 Go to previous message
Ray Erspamer is currently offline  Ray Erspamer   United States
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
Senior Member
D&R Engine & Machine in Marion IA.

http://drenginesmachine.com/


Ray Erspamer 78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen 403, 3.70 Final Drive Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System, Holley Hyperspark Ignition System 414-484-9431
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