Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Sudden Transmission Failure (transmission failure)
| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310349 is a reply to message #310223] |
Mon, 14 November 2016 19:35   |
Ray Erspamer
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
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Any update on what the problem is???
On Thu, Nov 10, 2016 at 9:59 PM, Ken Burton wrote:
> Those are the correct bolts. They are 12 point rather than the 6 point that you are use to seeing. Although you should have 6 per side. For now,
> just check to see if you have any number per side. When it fails to move because of missing bolts, ALL of the bolts will be missing on one side.
>
> If the bolts are there then you need to start looking at the fluid level and the possibility that the shift mechanism is not working inside the trans.
> I'm not good with the internals of the trans and Manny is our go to person on that. I also believe Jim Hupy is in your neighborhood. (I could be
> wrong on this) Look on the Black List and get his phone number.
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
>
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Ray Erspamer
78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
414-484-9431
Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
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Ray Erspamer
78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen
403, 3.70 Final Drive
Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System,
Holley Hyperspark Ignition System
414-484-9431
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310355 is a reply to message #310172] |
Mon, 14 November 2016 21:21 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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No change in engine load... Torque converter or chain?
My son's sport trac did just the same thing when the TC died... Nothing, nada, nope. Park and neutral did work...
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310540 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 09:40 |
lqqkatjon
Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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I had the pleasure to meet Andrew and his family yesterday. They are really great people, unfortunately I was absolutely no help to his transmission problem.
His Coach is a pretty decent 73, and actually looks like it was well taken care of mechanically by the PO. I am sad to say I was no help at all in any diagnosis of what happened to his transmission. The problem is Not external linkage or cable, or the CV bolts. Engine starts and runs perfect, and you can feel the linkage bump through all the gears indents just fine, however you have no noise, no indication of any transmission action. I did not verify if he truly had Park, but I believe it was there.
I did call and talk to Manny, and he told us to test the pressure and go from there. If it is the transmission, and it needs to come out and be replaced, it is not something that andrew will be tackled tomorrow, but I got the impression he has no intentions of parting ways with the coach. Beside the pressure test, is there any other suggestions for seeing if there is something that just happened that could cause it to possibly just not shift and get stuck in a neutral gear internal?
Also I am sure if there is any shops people in Portland might know that can R+R the transmission, I think Andrew would also entertain Suggestions.
The other question I kinda had, is he has a very small antique looking Kohler generator in the rear. Seemed like a nice unit. Was that a common replacement at sometime in the past?
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
[Updated on: Fri, 18 November 2016 09:42] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310545 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 10:41 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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I have one of the Kohler 4KW sets out of an SOB in the shop.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310546 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 10:45 |
Adrien G.
Messages: 474
Registered: May 2008
Location: Burns Flat, OK 73624
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Andrew,
Read through the thread again. Yes, the trans has oil, the shifter moves, the axle bolts are there, the trans prob seams to be internal.
What I don't read is if the oil filter has dislodged and sucking air (oil press check may or may not show that). It means raising the coach
to remove the pan, which could answer the filter, linkage condition, and also indicate the Trans condition by the sediments in the pan.
But, before the pan, I would disconnect the oil lines from the radiator, start engine for a few seconds (or just crank it) to see if the pump is pumping oil (which could answer about the filter).
FWIW at this late stage.
Andrew S. wrote on Wed, 09 November 2016 23:03Hello fellow GMCers,
This is my first ever post. I bought my 1973 Painted Desert 260 6 months ago. I was excited for the prospect of a work-in-progress, but boy, I am not sure I was ready for the stress of breaking down. So I am arriving at my brothers house in Portland, Oregon and it's a narrow residential city street. I menuever the GMC across the width of the street so I can begin carefully backing into his driveway. I then put the selector in Reverse, press the gas, AND... the engine revs and goes nowhere. what the...? Back to drive... nothing? What about S and L. Still Nothing. It seems like my choices are Park and Neutral. I am now blocking the whole street from ever being used again. My wife and child and dog are all barking at me and if I can't fix it I'll have to push this sweet dream machine into the Willamette. With the help of my He-Man brother we actually pushed GMC (we call it The Gator) into a parallel parking position (the driveway is uphill, so there is no way we can push it into the driveway). And now I am here at 11 pm to make my petition before the GMC Parliament: How do I begin to tackle this problem? What is wrong? Please help me!
Cheers!
Andrew
A little helpful background on me. I am a city boy, but I am not entirely un-handy. However, I am 28 and I got my drivers license just to buy this machine, so let's just say I am a fresh face on the scene.
Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
75 Glenbrook (26-3) Mods LS3.70 FD / Reaction Sys / 80mm Front&Intermidiate / Hydroboost / 16" Tires / Frame Rebuild / Interior Rebuild
Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310547 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 10:47 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Actually you did help by narrowing it to transmission internals. Another super simple test would be to dipstick the trans with the engine off and note the level. In this state it should be above the "full hot" mark as fluid has returned to pan. Then start it in park and wipe and re dipstick trans. Fluid level should drop 1/2" or so IF the pump is working. Have we ruled out a simple split O ring on the filter? Did you put it in D or L and rev to 3500 or so to see if it built any pressure momentarily? This is a odd failure unless it was previously severely abused, they usually fail in a more gradual manner.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310548 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 10:52 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Or--- has the little top hat come dislodged on the dipstick causing too much insertion, giving a false good level reading when in fact you are a quart low giving no pressure/ no drive.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310557 is a reply to message #310542] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 11:49 |
Olly Schmidt
Messages: 1265
Registered: February 2014
Location: Germany and Scottsville, ...
Karma: 8
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Mark,
> lqqkatjon wrote on Fri, 18 November 2016 09:40
>> ...The other question I kinda had, is he has a very small antique looking Kohler generator in the rear. Seemed like a nice unit. Was that a
>> common replacement at sometime in the past?
> A Kohler 4kw was OEM in some 1973 23' GMCs. My CanyonLands has one.
which one is louder? The Onan or the Kohler?
--
Best regards
Peer Oliver Schmidt
PGP Key ID: 0x83E1C2EA
'76a Eleganza II, VA
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Olly Schmidt
PGP Key ID: 0x18a9 3a1f 4196 bf22
'76a Eleganza II, VA
'73 Sequoia, SH, Germany
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310561 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 12:15 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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Both are 1800 RPM gensets, they make less racket than the 3600 ones. The Onan is a bit quieter, it's a twin instead of a single and consequiently a bit better balanced under load. When the A/C cycles on on the Kohler, you can tell for a moment. My genset repair guy calls the Kohlers 'Thumpers'.
johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310565 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 13:44 |
lqqkatjon
Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Interesting. I gave andrew the wrong info, i was certain the Kohler was not original. His is an early 73. I thought he was thinking one of the first 100 units by the Vin number.
That is a good thought for next step. drop the pan and have a look.
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
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| Re: Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310571 is a reply to message #310172] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 14:16 |
skip2
Messages: 544
Registered: September 2011
Location: Winter Haven,FL (center o...
Karma: 3
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Does the "park" setting hold the in place? If not, could have broken output shaft to final drive caused by a bad final drive pinion bearing like I did. If the "park" holds it then that's one more to rule out. Just a thought, a very little thought.
Skip Hartline
74 Canyon Lands, FiTech,
3.7 FD LSD, Manny Tranny,
Springfield Distributor,
2001 Chevy Tracker Ragtop Towd
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| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310575 is a reply to message #310571] |
Fri, 18 November 2016 15:13 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Skip, Should there be a broken spider in the final, it will not pull when
in gear. Maybe the trans is int going into park all the way .
Call me.
On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Skip Hartline
wrote:
> Does the "park" setting hold the in place? If not, could have broken
> output shaft to final drive caused by a bad final drive pinion bearing like
> I
> did. If the "park" holds it then that's one more to rule out. Just a
> thought, a very little thought.
> Skip Hartline
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310634 is a reply to message #310173] |
Sun, 20 November 2016 08:04 |
Ray Erspamer
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
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Senior Member |
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At this point I would drop the pan, it's not that big of a job, just
messy. Check the internal linkage and make sure the filter has a good
seal and that the filter is plugged.
On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 8:01 AM, Ray Erspamer wrote:
> As mentioned above, if the dipstick top-hat came loose and moved it
> could be severely under-filled.
> I had recorded that the distance from the top-hat to the full mark is
> 19 3/8". To the add mark it is 19 7/8"
>
> I had measured this from my OEM dipstick. I know there is some
> variation, but they're all fairly close to this.
>
> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:13 PM, Jim Kanomata wrote:
>> Skip, Should there be a broken spider in the final, it will not pull when
>> in gear. Maybe the trans is int going into park all the way .
>> Call me.
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Skip Hartline
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Does the "park" setting hold the in place? If not, could have broken
>>> output shaft to final drive caused by a bad final drive pinion bearing like
>>> I
>>> did. If the "park" holds it then that's one more to rule out. Just a
>>> thought, a very little thought.
>>> Skip Hartline
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jim Kanomata
>> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
>> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
>> http://www.appliedgmc.com
>> 1-800-752-7502
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
>
>
> --
> Ray Erspamer
> 78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
> Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
> Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
> Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
> 414-484-9431
> Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
--
Ray Erspamer
78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
414-484-9431
Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Ray Erspamer
78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen
403, 3.70 Final Drive
Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System,
Holley Hyperspark Ignition System
414-484-9431
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| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310635 is a reply to message #310575] |
Sun, 20 November 2016 08:01 |
Ray Erspamer
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
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Senior Member |
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As mentioned above, if the dipstick top-hat came loose and moved it
could be severely under-filled.
I had recorded that the distance from the top-hat to the full mark is
19 3/8". To the add mark it is 19 7/8"
I had measured this from my OEM dipstick. I know there is some
variation, but they're all fairly close to this.
On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:13 PM, Jim Kanomata wrote:
> Skip, Should there be a broken spider in the final, it will not pull when
> in gear. Maybe the trans is int going into park all the way .
> Call me.
>
> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Skip Hartline
> wrote:
>
>> Does the "park" setting hold the in place? If not, could have broken
>> output shaft to final drive caused by a bad final drive pinion bearing like
>> I
>> did. If the "park" holds it then that's one more to rule out. Just a
>> thought, a very little thought.
>> Skip Hartline
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
> http://www.appliedgmc.com
> 1-800-752-7502
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
--
Ray Erspamer
78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
414-484-9431
Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Ray Erspamer
78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen
403, 3.70 Final Drive
Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System,
Holley Hyperspark Ignition System
414-484-9431
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| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310648 is a reply to message #310634] |
Sun, 20 November 2016 12:00 |
Ray Erspamer
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
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Senior Member |
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I'm really hoping you can find a silver bullet here and easily get it
fixed. I know all too well how miserable transmission woes can be.
On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Ray Erspamer wrote:
> At this point I would drop the pan, it's not that big of a job, just
> messy. Check the internal linkage and make sure the filter has a good
> seal and that the filter is plugged.
>
> On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 8:01 AM, Ray Erspamer wrote:
>> As mentioned above, if the dipstick top-hat came loose and moved it
>> could be severely under-filled.
>> I had recorded that the distance from the top-hat to the full mark is
>> 19 3/8". To the add mark it is 19 7/8"
>>
>> I had measured this from my OEM dipstick. I know there is some
>> variation, but they're all fairly close to this.
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:13 PM, Jim Kanomata wrote:
>>> Skip, Should there be a broken spider in the final, it will not pull when
>>> in gear. Maybe the trans is int going into park all the way .
>>> Call me.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Skip Hartline
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Does the "park" setting hold the in place? If not, could have broken
>>>> output shaft to final drive caused by a bad final drive pinion bearing like
>>>> I
>>>> did. If the "park" holds it then that's one more to rule out. Just a
>>>> thought, a very little thought.
>>>> Skip Hartline
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jim Kanomata
>>> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
>>> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
>>> http://www.appliedgmc.com
>>> 1-800-752-7502
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ray Erspamer
>> 78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
>> Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
>> Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
>> Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
>> 414-484-9431
>> Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
>
>
>
> --
> Ray Erspamer
> 78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
> Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
> Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
> Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
> 414-484-9431
> Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
--
Ray Erspamer
78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
414-484-9431
Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Ray Erspamer
78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen
403, 3.70 Final Drive
Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System,
Holley Hyperspark Ignition System
414-484-9431
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| Re: [GMCnet] Sudden Transmission Failure [message #310797 is a reply to message #310648] |
Wed, 23 November 2016 10:00 |
Ray Erspamer
Messages: 1707
Registered: May 2007
Location: Milwaukee Wisconsin
Karma: -3
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Senior Member |
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Any update on the problem???
On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 12:00 PM, Ray Erspamer wrote:
> I'm really hoping you can find a silver bullet here and easily get it
> fixed. I know all too well how miserable transmission woes can be.
>
> On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 8:04 AM, Ray Erspamer wrote:
>> At this point I would drop the pan, it's not that big of a job, just
>> messy. Check the internal linkage and make sure the filter has a good
>> seal and that the filter is plugged.
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 20, 2016 at 8:01 AM, Ray Erspamer wrote:
>>> As mentioned above, if the dipstick top-hat came loose and moved it
>>> could be severely under-filled.
>>> I had recorded that the distance from the top-hat to the full mark is
>>> 19 3/8". To the add mark it is 19 7/8"
>>>
>>> I had measured this from my OEM dipstick. I know there is some
>>> variation, but they're all fairly close to this.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 3:13 PM, Jim Kanomata wrote:
>>>> Skip, Should there be a broken spider in the final, it will not pull when
>>>> in gear. Maybe the trans is int going into park all the way .
>>>> Call me.
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 18, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Skip Hartline
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Does the "park" setting hold the in place? If not, could have broken
>>>> > output shaft to final drive caused by a bad final drive pinion bearing like
>>>> > I
>>>> > did. If the "park" holds it then that's one more to rule out. Just a
>>>> > thought, a very little thought.
>>>> > Skip Hartline
>>>> >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > GMCnet mailing list
>>>> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>>> > http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Jim Kanomata
>>>> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
>>>> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
>>>> http://www.appliedgmc.com
>>>> 1-800-752-7502
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ray Erspamer
>>> 78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
>>> Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
>>> Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
>>> Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
>>> 414-484-9431
>>> Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ray Erspamer
>> 78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
>> Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
>> Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
>> Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
>> 414-484-9431
>> Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
>
>
>
> --
> Ray Erspamer
> 78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
> Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
> Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
> Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
> 414-484-9431
> Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
--
Ray Erspamer
78 Royale - "The Great Lakes Eagle"
Center Kitchen TZE368V101144
Wauwatosa, Wisconsin 53226
Email: 78GMCRoyale@gmail.com
414-484-9431
Web Site: http://ray-lisa.page.tl/
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Ray Erspamer
78 GMC Royale Center Kitchen
403, 3.70 Final Drive
Holley Sniper Quadrajet EFI System,
Holley Hyperspark Ignition System
414-484-9431
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