Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings
Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124224] |
Mon, 02 May 2011 12:45 |
A Hamilto
Messages: 4508 Registered: April 2011
Karma: 39
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Pretty much without exception, every time I apply grease to to a component with a grease gun, I pump the handle until it squeezes out somewhere. I understand that is not the correct way with GMC Motorhome fitted with front wheel bearing zerks because you will "blow out" the rear seals. So what is the "correct" way to grease them (how many "pumps")? But here is my real question: Couldn't there be another hole drilled somewhere in the assembly with a removable plug that you could remove the plug and pump grease into the zerk until grease comes out the hole (and then replace the plug)? That would give me more assurance that I have applied enough grease, and hopefully prevent blowing out the rear seal. Is that realistic?
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124298 is a reply to message #124293] |
Mon, 02 May 2011 18:35 |
shawnee
Messages: 422 Registered: February 2004 Location: NC
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ahamilto wrote on Mon, 02 May 2011 19:03 | I read those some time ago and that info is what prompted my question. I generally pump more than "a couple" of times on the gun, and want to fill that cavity without blowing out the inner seals. Maybe I will just take out another mortgage on the house and get a Hubler 1-ton front end. Or leave the money pit parked in the driveway for a few more years while I save up for one.
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If you move the axle back far enough you will clear the grease seal and you can pump all you want and get grease out without pushing the seal out. I usually pump enough to get new grease coming out. I do it every fall after the last rally. If you do not push the axle out far enough you can push the seal out of place.
Gene Dotson
74 Canyonlands
www.bdub.net/Motorhome_Enhancements New Windows and Aluminum Radiators
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124333 is a reply to message #124224] |
Mon, 02 May 2011 23:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912 Registered: July 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Mark,
To grease the front wheel bearings on a GMC that has zerk fittings
installed:
1) Loosen all wheel nuts on the front wheels.
2) Jack GMC up high enough to get front wheels off the ground.
3) Support the GMC on jack stands.
4) Remove both front wheels.
5) Thoroughly clean the housing of the outer CV joint and the back of the
steering knuckle around the CV joint.
6) Remove the cotter pin from both front axle nuts.
7) Have an assistant sit in the coach and apply the brakes while you loosen
then remove the front axle nuts.
8) Push the front axles (CV joints) inwards as much as possible.
9) Attach grease gun to the grease zerk and pump grease into the bearing
until you can see fresh grease coming out between the seal and the CV joint.
10) Push the front axle back into the hub, install the axle nut and torque
it as per the Maintenance Manual then install the cotter pin.
11) Replace the wheels and hub caps.
I've typed this from memory and if I've over looked anything or screwed it
up PLEASE correct me.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2011 1:45 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings
Pretty much without exception, every time I apply grease to to a component
with a grease gun, I pump the handle until it squeezes out somewhere. I
understand that is not the correct way with GMC Motorhome fitted with front
wheel bearing zerks because you will "blow out" the rear seals. So what is
the "correct" way to grease them (how many "pumps")? But here is my real
question: Couldn't there be another hole drilled somewhere in the assembly
with a removable plug that you could remove the plug and pump grease into
the zerk until grease comes out the hole (and then replace the plug)? That
would give me more assurance that I have applied enough grease, and
hopefully prevent blowing out the rear seal. Is that realistic?
--
'73 23' CanyonLands
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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Re: Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124386 is a reply to message #124224] |
Tue, 03 May 2011 13:11 |
g.winger
Messages: 792 Registered: February 2008 Location: Warrenton,Missouri
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ahamilto,,,if you do the math, replacing with the Hubler conversion is cheaper(ie. less) than using standard GMC parts. Now we have to compare apples to apples,not oranges. I'm not going to do the math here because I've done it before and you can search my old posts. When you have the knuckles out you really should have the lower control arms reinforced. If you don't think thats needed, search for Steve Fergusons tech sheet/photos. Going to need new bushings too, so count those also. When I went to sell my knucles and hubs, Dave L. knew that they had been bushed,(practically worthless,to tight)while he was screwing down the press!!(Dave won't rebuild knuckels that have been bushed,runs up the cost of a standard GMC rebuild) Just my 2 cents worth,,,,,,PL
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124432 is a reply to message #124386] |
Tue, 03 May 2011 15:23 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912 Registered: July 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Paul,
I agree with the math, however, I asked a question that no one could answer
when Stan gave a presentation on the conversion at Patterson.
The distance between the upper and lower ball joint mounting points in the
knuckles goes from 9 inches to 11 inches. The angle at which the upper
control arm rides is higher. The angle between the upper ball joint socket
and the ball and shaft is much closer to the inside edge. Has anyone ever
jacked the suspension up as high as possible and verified that the ball and
shaft of the upper ball joint does not hit the upper ball joint socket?
A secondary question is - how does the changed angle between the upper and
lower control arms affect the coaches steering and handling. I'm looking for
a theoretical not empirical response. I realize if it wasn't acceptable
people wouldn't install it!
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Paul Leavitt
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2011 2:12 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings
ahamilto,,,if you do the math, replacing with the Hubler conversion is
cheaper(ie. less) than using standard GMC parts. Now we have to compare
apples to apples,not oranges. I'm not going to do the math here because I've
done it before and you can search my old posts. When you have the knuckles
out you really should have the lower control arms reinforced. If you don't
think thats needed, search for Steve Fergusons tech sheet/photos. Going to
need new bushings too, so count those also. When I went to sell my knucles
and hubs, Dave L. knew that they had been bushed,(practically worthless,to
tight)while he was screwing down the press!!(Dave won't rebuild knuckels
that have been bushed,runs up the cost of a standard GMC rebuild) Just my 2
cents worth,,,,,,PL
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124454 is a reply to message #124333] |
Tue, 03 May 2011 16:35 |
A Hamilto
Messages: 4508 Registered: April 2011
Karma: 39
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Robert Mueller wrote on Mon, 02 May 2011 23:15 | 9) Attach grease gun to the grease zerk and pump grease into the bearing until you can see fresh grease coming out between the seal and the CV joint.
| I could live with that, but I was under the impression that if you do that, you have "blown out" the seal (not actually displaced the seal itself, just changed the orientation of the edge that presses against the axle from "facing" the nut end to "facing" the cv joint, thereby rendering it unable to hold grease and allowing dirt in). Anyway, my ride is pretty stock, so I don't think anyone has ever installed zerks. When I get around to jacking it up and working on it, I will have to decide if I am going to stay with stock bearings or upgrade to the 1-ton. Since I don't have bearing tools, I thought I would take the knuckle/bearing assemblies off and send to JimB to get them greased and zerks installed. If it less expensive to install a Hubler kit, I will go that route.
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Re: Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124504 is a reply to message #124224] |
Tue, 03 May 2011 21:31 |
Firefly
Messages: 98 Registered: May 2008 Location: Augusta, Maine
Karma: 0
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I didn't know JB did the zerk upgrade; I had him do three knuckle rebuilds so far and it was never offered to me as an option.
In hindsight, I do wish I had known about the Hubler option before that happened, of course, but as Jim told me that he would not install the 80 mm caliper upgrade up front, nor a disc conversion in the back because of liability concerns, I did assume that he would espouse the same policy towards the Hubler option.
Now that I am back to work, that conversation may be on the horizon.
How much is a Hubler conversion? Is it in "kit" form?
I saw a slide show and it mentioned in the bill of materials that 3" aluminum spacers were still required to equalize the width with the rear tire track; isn't there any way to extend the axles and control arms to achieve the extra width without placing extra/undue strain on the wheel hub & bearing?
Air Ride Technologies makes GM 3500 Control Arms with air bag mounts and I was wondering whether chromoly-constructed control arms would give us any better capability to adapt the 1-tom setup. If the stock 3500 is too short as I suspect, a longer setup could be developed that alters the baseline angle of the upper ball joint to compensate for the higher altitude and aspect ratio; this was done in the early days of Mustang suspension research by adding a simple billet wedge under the ball joint to cant it over so it would not bind. Since the GM coach is ten times the Mustang's weight, a wedge may not be the best implementation of a sound concept in this case - a welded wedge or modified/canted mounting position would be more practical and inherently stronger.
Does anyone know about the 3500 suspension in relation to our coach's?
Using air bags to supplement the torsion bar suspension would be an interesting experiment, especially with the option to use either single or double-adjustable (compression and rebound) integrated shock absorbers. The ride could be amazing.
Mark Scoble, Lunenburg, MA - 1973 23' Palm Beach Stretched to 32' and in residence at the GMC Co-Op in Orlando, FL
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #124537 is a reply to message #124454] |
Wed, 04 May 2011 07:32 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912 Registered: July 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Mark,
8) Push the front axles (CV joints) inwards as much as possible.
This disengages the seal COMPELETLY from the CV joint and leaves a gap that
the grease can flow through.
By the way this is the way Dave Lenzi greases his front bearings.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Mark
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2011 5:35 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings
Robert Mueller wrote on Mon, 02 May 2011 23:15
> 9) Attach grease gun to the grease zerk and pump grease into the bearing
until you can see fresh grease coming out between the seal and the CV joint.
I could live with that, but I was under the impression that if you do that,
you have "blown out" the seal (not actually displaced the seal itself, just
changed the orientation of the edge that presses against the axle from
"facing" the nut end to "facing" the cv joint, thereby rendering it unable
to hold grease and allowing dirt in). Anyway, my ride is pretty stock, so I
don't think anyone has ever installed zerks. When I get around to jacking
it up and working on it, I will have to decide if I am going to stay with
stock bearings or upgrade to the 1-ton. Since I don't have bearing tools, I
thought I would take the knuckle/bearing assemblies off and send to JimB to
get them greased and zerks installed. If it less expensive to install a
Hubler kit, I will go that route.
--
'73 23' CanyonLands
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GMCnet mailing list
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http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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Re: Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #218427 is a reply to message #124224] |
Thu, 15 August 2013 08:25 |
lw8000
Messages: 201 Registered: July 2012 Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 1
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Just a general question on this discussion...
I understand that the original instructions in the manual for the front bearings maintenance procedures were written before synthetic grease. With modern synthetic grease (that is not supposed to dry up and/or separate like the dino grease), is it still necessary for this procedure, or at least as often? My understanding is that synthetic should last a lot longer and doesn't break down as easily.
The reason I'm asking is our GMC is currently in the shop and they are going to replace the front bearings. They will be packing the new bearings with Amsoil synthetic grease. We've talked to them about adding the zerks, but with the long life and different characteristics of synthetic grease I am wondering if the zerks are really necessary.
Just wanted to get some feedback. Thanks for the great information!
--
Chris
Chris S. -
77 Kingsley, 3.70 FD, mostly OEM -
S.E. Michigan
[Updated on: Thu, 15 August 2013 08:26] Report message to a moderator
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #218428 is a reply to message #218427] |
Thu, 15 August 2013 08:39 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446 Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Chris,
IMPHO I would suggest that you do install the grease zerks for the front bearings. You could get 80 to 100 thousand mile out of your bearings by greasing them at least once a year. I know that Dave Lenzi has over 80 K miles on the set he has in the coach and when checked them last year they looked new. He grease twice a year because of the miles he does each year. Synthetic greases may not break down as easily but the fresh grease flushes out any dirt that may have got by the seals.
JR Wright
78 Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion
Michigan
On Aug 15, 2013, at 9:25 AM, LW <tux@apex-internet.com> wrote:
>
>
> Just a general question on this discussion...
>
> I understand that the original instructions in the manual for the front bearings maintenance procedures were written before synthetic grease. With modern synthetic grease (that is not supposed to dry up and/or separate like the dino grease), is it still necessary for this procedure? My understanding is that synthetic should last a lot longer and doesn't break down as easily.
>
> The reason I'm asking is our GMC is currently in the shop and they are going to replace the front bearings. They will be packing the new bearings with Amsoil synthetic grease. We've talked to them about adding the zerks, but with the long life and different characteristics of synthetic grease I am wondering if the zerks are really necessary.
>
> Just wanted to get some feedback. Thanks for the great information!
>
> --
> Chris
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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Re: [GMCnet] Installing Grease Zerks For Front Wheel Bearings [message #218429 is a reply to message #218427] |
Thu, 15 August 2013 08:41 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446 Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Forgot to add the link for the drawings.
http://www.bdub.net/pictures/birch/Birch-HubZerk.jpg
JR Wright
78 Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion
Michigan
On Aug 15, 2013, at 9:25 AM, LW <tux@apex-internet.com> wrote:
>
>
> Just a general question on this discussion...
>
> I understand that the original instructions in the manual for the front bearings maintenance procedures were written before synthetic grease. With modern synthetic grease (that is not supposed to dry up and/or separate like the dino grease), is it still necessary for this procedure? My understanding is that synthetic should last a lot longer and doesn't break down as easily.
>
> The reason I'm asking is our GMC is currently in the shop and they are going to replace the front bearings. They will be packing the new bearings with Amsoil synthetic grease. We've talked to them about adding the zerks, but with the long life and different characteristics of synthetic grease I am wondering if the zerks are really necessary.
>
> Just wanted to get some feedback. Thanks for the great information!
>
> --
> Chris
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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