Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It?
| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116400 is a reply to message #116338] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 18:10   |
Mike Teets
Messages: 299
Registered: January 2004
Location: Dublin, OH
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The real question seems to be "what events will cause GMC fuel costs to
diverge from inflation or alternatives". We really need to consider the
price of fuel relative to income, or fuel compared to flying, or diesel
compared to gas, or GMC compared to modern motorhomes. Driving a motorhome
has always been more expensive than driving a car. I just doubt temporary
swings will be enough to dissuade this already fanatical group from their
long term mission.
Mike
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 10:16 AM, Phil Swanson <woodyman1@sbcglobal.net>wrote:
>
>
> It is no secret that gas prices are headed for new levels, well above $4 a
> gallon, maybe $5 by summer. Just curious when folks are going to park it
> and at what level. Will you drive your coach at $5 a gallon or more? How
> about long trips to rallies at over $5 a gallon? My cross country summer
> trips are probably put on hold for a while. How do you feel and at what
> level do you park it? At $6 a gallon, mine will become a storage pod, only
> to be started once in a while. What is your limit?
>
> Phil Swanson
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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77 Palm Beach, 260, 403
Dublin, OH
http://teamteets.com/gmc/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116402 is a reply to message #116398] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 18:28 |
Craig Lechowicz
Messages: 541
Registered: October 2006
Location: Waterford, MI
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I vaguely remember long ago that AmTrak had a motorhome train along the east coast, where you put your m/h on a flat car, got passenger tickets and went from somewhere in New England to Florida and back at certain times during the year. I remember thinking it was kind of expensive back then, but it was in the era of gas prices under $1 a gallon. If something like that sprung up along a few transcontinental routes, it would be interesting to see how well it worked. Trains are really efficient at moving big heavy stuff long distances.
Craig Lechowicz
'77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116403 is a reply to message #116398] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 18:31 |
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gordh1
Messages: 332
Registered: February 2011
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Hi Rob,
No worries - no problem at all. I can cite...none! I'm sizing engines based mostly from large cars, SUVs and trucks, most usually lighter than 12k lbs.
What I'm looking at are torque and power, engine design and availability. Front-wheel drive (or 4WD) score the big points. MPG of any of the modern designs is double if not more (usually more - often close to triple), so I take back some for the weight.
Now, I have to say, I'm no doubt a special case (as if you didn't already figure that one out!)  and I'd go to extremes to get the coach weight down [sidebar to that is it seems many have commented of the weight of some of the internals on certain models as being rediculously overweight], and just travelling light.
The mentioned VW V10TDI appears to be quite a nice choice - just need to find one complete that's been wrecked but still running.
David's Vortec L18 install is awesome! Sadly though Rob, I can't call an engine that's still just a derivative of an old iron big block anything close to state of the art - I'm really sorry.
I believe I see a belt driven fan for cooling so as an obvious mod, I'd wager Dave could pick up a mpg by pitching the fan for an electric or a pair of electrics that run when needed. I can't tell if that's bolted up to the original transaxle, but if so...well, there's another 'issue' that's never going to help fuel economy simply by design.
Any time Rob - really - no worries. I enjoy the discussion and debate sincerely.
Gord 
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116412 is a reply to message #116407] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 19:46 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Kathy and I travel as often as our jobs allow. Because we can usually only manage to get ten or eleven days off at a time, we have had to limit our trips in the motorhome to around 1,500 - 1,800 miles, round trip. Other trips we take involve plane tickets , rental cars, and restaurant meals. We have still found the GMC trips to be the least costly even though we use credit card points for air travel and hotel stays as much as possible.
As the cost of gas goes up, I don't expect that to change a whole lot. After all, the price of jet fuel is going up too and the airlines are raising their fares accordingly. The cost of rental cars and hotels has gone up lately too. Eating out two or three times a day probably costs three to four times the cost of buying groceries (which you would be consuming at home anyway) and cooking in your coach, not to mention often not nearly as healthy.
Additionally there are ways to make RV travel more economical, as mentioned in other posts. Two or three nights of dry camping or low cost camping (state parks, for instance) between paying for a space at an RV park is one more I haven't seen suggested.
We enjoy travel in our GMC so much that we will probably give up other things before we will quit driving it because of the price of gas.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116416 is a reply to message #116389] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 19:54 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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| carguy wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 14:41 |
I have always contended that fuel is the least expensive cost of owning a GMC or any motorhome or boat or airplane or . . for that matter. If I wanted better mpg I'd drive slower and that's not going to happen.
Fuel prices are determined by international politics which is why we need to work toward becoming independent by using our own oil.
Being "green" isn't an issue for me because I don't buy into the myth of human affected global climate change.
End of rant!
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I have to say I agree with Bill on all counts.
I have spent much more on the purchase and improvements I have made on my coach than I have on gas over the course of my ownership.
Fuel prices are controlled more by the commodities market than any other factor.
Al Gore's millions not withstanding, there is plenty of science that says that so called "global warming" (since that's not happening, they have changed the name to "climate change") is not happening at all and plenty more that says it is not caused by Man.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116417 is a reply to message #116416] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 19:56 |
rwbmitiopt@comcast.net
Messages: 189
Registered: April 2005
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And the earth is flat.
Randall
[quote title=Carl S. wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 17:54]carguy wrote on Thu,
Being "green" isn't an issue for me because I don't buy into the myth of human affected global climate change.
End of rant![/quote |
I have to say I agree with Bill on all counts.
I have spent much more on the purchase and improvements I have made on my coach than I have on gas over the course of my ownership.
Fuel prices are controlled more by the commodities market than any other factor.
Al Gore's millions not withstanding, there is plenty of science that says that so called "global warming" (since that's not happening, they have changed the name to "climate change") is not happening at all and plenty more that says it is not caused by Man.
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Randall Burns
Sammamish WA
75 EX GB
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| Re: Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116421 is a reply to message #116338] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 20:19 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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I have a mechanic friend who is also an RVer (an SOB) who always makes fun of me when I discuss things I have done to try to improve my Gas mileage on the motorhome. Although he admits that things like the 3.70 final drive and the MSD ignition will make incremental differences in my fuel economy (kind of an oxymoron in this case) he contends that they will not save me enough mopney on gas to ever pay for themselves and that if I were making these improvements strictly to save gas (which I'm not), that would be silly. I have to admit, he's right.
There are certain factors of physics that will prevent a motorhome from getting wonderful fuel economy. If I had taken the 30+ mpg engine out of my wife's '97 Saturn, for instance, and put it in my GMC, it would certainly not get very good gas mileage or last very long, much less provide any level of usable power. I have a 2000 Dodge, 1-ton utility truck with a multi-port, computerized fuel injected 8 litre (488 ci) V-10 in it. It has a modern overdrive transmission and weighs about 10,000 pounds. It barely gets any better gas mileage than my '75 GMC.
As far as I know, the only conversions that have given anyone substantially better fuel economy, in a GMC Motorhome, have been diesels. I don't believe they will will prove economically feasible for most of us though. If you want economy, buy a Sprinter or VW based motorhome, not a GMC
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116422 is a reply to message #116417] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 20:21 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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[quote title=Randall wrote on Thu, 24 February 2011 18:56]And the earth is flat.
Randall
Sure Randy...if you want to believe that...
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116427 is a reply to message #116421] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 21:00 |
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gordh1
Messages: 332
Registered: February 2011
Karma: 0
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Hi Carl,
| Quote: |
... my wife's '97 Saturn...
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At 120-some hp and ~ torque, I don't think that would work - or agreed, not for very long!
| Quote: |
2000 Dodge, 1-ton utility truck with a multi-port, computerized fuel injected 8 litre (488 ci) V-10 in it. It has a modern overdrive transmission and weighs about 10,000 pounds. It barely gets any better gas mileage than my '75 GMC.
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According to specs out there... it actually is no better! Sadly it's still not a true modern internal combustion engine ("Originally conceived in the 1980s"), and although I bet it makes a lovely note, without a FWD transmission, would be a devil to install. Excuse the expression but that would be "replacing a dog with a dog".
| Quote: |
If you want economy, buy a Sprinter or VW based motorhome, not a GMC
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It's crossing my mind, but they're just not as nifty as the GMCs and there's a lack of challenge to consider as well. I'm after the best of both worlds (ummm...flat...and round?)
Gord 
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| Re: Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116456 is a reply to message #116338] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 23:09 |
Craig Lechowicz
Messages: 541
Registered: October 2006
Location: Waterford, MI
Karma: 0
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Gord,
Not sure what fits your definition of a "modern" engine. DOHC and 4 valves per cylinders date back to the 20's. Diesels live in a different fuel economy class than gas engines primarily because the fuel has higher btu content, and because they don't throttle the air intake, so they have lower pumping losses. They probably represent the only way you could get a GMC from 10 mpg to 20 without going to something very exotic in the gas world, like homogeneous charged compression ignition, which is always 5 years away. There might be gains of 5% in dohc/4valve, 3% in variable valve timing, and 3% each in roller rocker arms, and roller cam followers. But all those are individual improvements, and it's less when you add them all together. Direct injection engines with turbos could add to that (Ford Ecoboost or the GM turbo 4's) but I think 2011 is the 1st year Ford's put one in a 1/2 ton pickup and I'm thinking there is a reason that they don't use it in 3/4 or 1 ton's yet, most likely rated to duty cycle and cooling issues. (320 hp and 420 ft. lb. torque would meet our requirements until something bad happened, at least). It's rated at 21 mpg highway in a vehicle with less than 1/2 the weight, maybe 2/3 of the frontal area, twice as many transmission speeds, massive amounts of exhaust recirculation to limit pumping losses, and lots of other tweaks and tricks on the vehicle side. (lower rolling resistance tires, low friction brakes, 2 less wheels and wheel bearings, and lots of aero tricks). So, to make a long story short, mileage gains, even for automakers have a tendency to come in 0.1 mpg's at a time, and not whole numbers or two digit ones.
Craig Lechowicz
'77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116457 is a reply to message #116338] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 23:13 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Phil,
Looks like Grace and I will eat more rice in our coach and no more
Steak and Lobster at a restuant.
Stop at parking lots more and throw away our KOA Camping cards.
Also learn to drive 55mph, no more 65-75 speeds.
It might be fun trying to work at streatching the gas as we travel.
We picked up a 78 GMC today and hope that will become the coach that
we will keep in the Mid West for Conventions and Ralleys.
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 7:16 AM, Phil Swanson <woodyman1@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>
> It is no secret that gas prices are headed for new levels, well above $4 a gallon, maybe $5 by summer. Just curious when folks are going to park it and at what level. Will you drive your coach at $5 a gallon or more? How about long trips to rallies at over $5 a gallon? My cross country summer trips are probably put on hold for a while. How do you feel and at what level do you park it? At $6 a gallon, mine will become a storage pod, only to be started once in a while. What is your limit?
>
> Phil Swanson
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
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www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116458 is a reply to message #116399] |
Thu, 24 February 2011 23:15 |
gmcrv1
Messages: 839
Registered: August 2007
Location: Memphis
Karma: -1
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Rob,
Of course I was referring to you - but "special" allows for a greater
interpretation!
When do you hit the states?
Hope all is well.
Tom E
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 6:12 PM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Tom,
>
> I assume you are talking about me but I'm surprised that you noted I was a
> "special case" and not a "nut case!" ;-)
>
> In a "nut shell" petrol here in Sydney is $1.25 AUS per liter which
> converts
> to $4.88 US per gallon.
>
> I consider myself lucky here in Australia, check out the link below!
>
> http://www.usa-vs-uk.com/petrol.html
>
> Will fuel prices ever stop me from driving Double Trouble? Nope, we bought
> it to tour the USA and will continue to do so until I feel I am not capable
> of driving it safely.
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> USAussie - Downunder
> AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
> USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Tom Eckert
> Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 4:58 AM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It?
>
> Mike,
>
> I agree - especially the part about "Rob is a special case". We should be
> hearing from him shortly! (lol)
>
> Also, as the cost of operation goes up, there may be more GMCs on the
> auction block so owning several may be rather affordable.
>
> Tom E
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116464 is a reply to message #116458] |
Fri, 25 February 2011 01:16 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Tom,
I arrive in Houston on April 3rd. I plan on attending the GMCMI Convention
in Patterson, and the Bean Station rally.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Tom Eckert
Sent: Friday, February 25, 2011 4:16 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It?
Rob,
Of course I was referring to you - but "special" allows for a greater
interpretation!
When do you hit the states?
Hope all is well.
Tom E
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Gas Prices- At What Point Do You Park It? [message #116469 is a reply to message #116457] |
Fri, 25 February 2011 07:46 |
shawnee
Messages: 422
Registered: February 2004
Location: NC
Karma: 0
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| jimk wrote on Fri, 25 February 2011 00:13 |
Phil,
Looks like Grace and I will eat more rice in our coach and no more
Steak and Lobster at a restuant.
Stop at parking lots more and throw away our KOA Camping cards.
Also learn to drive 55mph, no more 65-75 speeds.
It might be fun trying to work at streatching the gas as we travel.
We picked up a 78 GMC today and hope that will become the coach that
we will keep in the Mid West for Conventions and Ralleys.
|
Jim,
When have you ever driven below 75 mph except when you run out of gas? We are not supposed to bend the truth on the GMC net.
Gene Dotson
74 Canyonlands
www.bdub.net/Motorhome_Enhancements New Windows and Aluminum Radiators
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