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[GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328589]

Thu, 25 January 2018 13:30

emerystora

Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004

Karma: 13

Senior Member

I’ve often wondered why people use transmission fluid for this. Transmission fluid is a kerosene base stock with corrosion inhibitors, rubber swell additives, and anti-foam additives.

The additives are not needed for a penetrating application so why not use a kerosene / acetone mixture. Much cheaper than transmission fluid.

Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick, CO

> On Jan 25, 2018, at 10:33 AM, John Wright wrote:
>
> Bob,
> I did an actual test on the different mixes of ATF and Power Steering Fluid. See the following:
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g5305-loosening-rusted-bolts.html
>
> Regards,
>
> J.R. Wright
> GMC GreatLakerTech Editor
> 78 Buskirk 30' Stretch
> 75 Avion Under Reconstruction
> Michigan (On Location in Tucson)
>
>> On Jan 25, 2018, at 12:47 AM, Rob Mueller wrote:
>>
>> Bob,
>>
>> Here you go:
>>
>> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/aa-miscellaneous-photos/p40657-penetrating-oil-test.html
>>
>> Regards,
>> Rob M.
>> The Pedantic Mechanic
>> Sydney, Australia
>> AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
>> USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
>> USA '77 Kingsley - TZE 267V100808
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Bob Dunahugh
>> Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 5:38 PM
>> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] GMCNet Portional Value.
>>
>> What is the value of this mix? Why? Bob Dunahugh
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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328590 is a reply to message #328589]

Thu, 25 January 2018 13:40

k2gkk

Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009

Karma: -8

Senior Member

Availability of kerosene in very small quantities and easy-dispensing containers?

D C "Mac" Macdonald
Amateur Radio K2GKK
Since 30 November '53
USAF and FAA, Retired
Member GMCMI & Classics
Oklahoma City, OK
"The Money Pit"
TZE166V101966
'76 ex-Palm Beach
k2gkk + hotmail dot com

From: Gmclist on behalf of Emery Stora
Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2018 13:30
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture

I’ve often wondered why people use transmission fluid for this. Transmission fluid is a kerosene base stock with corrosion inhibitors, rubber swell additives, and anti-foam additives.

The additives are not needed for a penetrating application so why not use a kerosene / acetone mixture. Much cheaper than transmission fluid.

Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick, CO

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328592 is a reply to message #328589]

Thu, 25 January 2018 14:09

77Royale

Messages: 461
Registered: June 2014
Location: Mid Michigan

Karma: 6

Senior Member

I know there are a few gas stations here that sell it at the pump. Usually 3-4 dollars a gallon. Otherwise, its home depot, lowes, menards for a 15 dollar a gallon non soot can of it. Sell it next to the kero space heaters, but I cant imagine those places in warmer climates carry them in stock.

77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy. Mid Michigan

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328599 is a reply to message #328592]

Thu, 25 January 2018 18:11

Emery Stora

Messages: 959
Registered: January 2011

Karma: 4

Senior Member

Diesel fuel is kerosene. About any service station sells it for probably under $3.00 / gallon.

Emery Stora

> On Jan 25, 2018, at 1:09 PM, Wayne Rogewski wrote:
>
> I know there are a few gas stations here that sell it at the pump. Usually 3-4 dollars a gallon. Otherwise, its home depot, lowes, menards for a 15
> dollar a gallon non soot can of it. Sell it next to the kero space heaters, but I cant imagine those places in warmer climates carry them in stock.
>
>
> --
> 77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy.
> Mid Michigan
>
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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328600 is a reply to message #328589]

Thu, 25 January 2018 18:43

jhbridges

Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga

Karma: -74

Senior Member

Diesel and kerosene stink. ATF is a much better lube than either I'd admire to see your result with either though.

.--johnny

Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons. Braselton, Ga. I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328614 is a reply to message #328600]

Thu, 25 January 2018 23:01

emerystora

Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004

Karma: 13

Senior Member

On what do you base your comment regarding lubricity of the three fluids?

Have you checked the BOTD or HFRR or SL BOCLE tests for diesel, kerosene and ATF?

Emery Stora

> On Jan 25, 2018, at 5:43 PM, Johnny Bridges via Gmclist wrote:
>
> Diesel and kerosene stink. ATF is a much better lube than either I'd admire to see your result with either though.
>
> .--johnny
> --
> 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
> Braselton, Ga.
> "I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell" - ol Andy, paraphrased
>
>
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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328616 is a reply to message #328589]

Fri, 26 January 2018 06:34

jhbridges

Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga

Karma: -74

Senior Member

Feel free to quote them Smile

I based it on the use for which of the three were developed.

--johnny

Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons. Braselton, Ga. I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328622 is a reply to message #328589]

Fri, 26 January 2018 09:21

THOMAS R WHITTON

Messages: 47
Registered: September 2016

Karma: -1

Member

Ken, Ken and Emery,
I was going to start wrenching the brake line nuts (that are stuck to the lines) on the proportional valve today but may put it off another day to gather up a small butane torch, line nut locking pliers and some diesel fuel to change the ingredients in the "witches brew" penetrant. One more day won't hurt anything and just might save installing new lines. If the suggested tools and procedures work it will certainly help me and our community. These gorgeous machines are showing their age under the skin. Proportional valves and fittings are sure to need attention for more and more coaches as the sand flows through the hour glass. I'll report the eventual outcome. Thanks again for the suggestions.
All the best,
Tom Whitton26 foot updated GMCPaducah, Ky
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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328623 is a reply to message #328622]

Fri, 26 January 2018 10:40

Ken Burton

Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana

Karma: 10

Senior Member

I'm thinking that changing the mix will not help. The recommended mix is Power Steering Fluid or ATF and acetone. Shake well before using. Any diesel that you do find will be #2. ATF or PSF which has been tested is closer to kerosene or #1 diesel. (Good luck finding #1) The PSF or ATF is available everywhere. You are not mixing up a lot of it. For convenience I just use Kroil or in a pinch Liquid Wrench. (I know I said incorrectly PB blaster before.)

You are not using very much of it. The thing is to get it to penetrate. So heat expansion and uneven cooling contraction will help a lot when applying whatever penetrating oil you are using.

The special vice grips are nice but you are working on getting the nut loose from the line. So be very careful and do NOT do anything more that bust the nut SLIGHTLY loose with them. Any more than that will twist and break the line off.

As I first said: patience, patience, patience.

Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328625 is a reply to message #328589]

Fri, 26 January 2018 11:22

THOMAS R WHITTON

Messages: 47
Registered: September 2016

Karma: -1

Member

Ken,
I have been squirting and brushing with a 50/50 mix of acetone and ATF. Emery suggested diesel fuel rather than ATF so I thought I'd give it a try. But, will now continue with the first brew. I'm on my way to get pencil torches at Tractor Supply. No one in town has line nut locking pliers so will proceed without. I do have good, Snap On, line wrenches. All but one of the nuts is already loose. The problem is the nuts were frozen to the lines. This PM I'll use heat and shock with more witches brew. Will report...
Thanks,
Tom Whitton 26 foot upgraded GMCPaducah, Ky
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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328627 is a reply to message #328625]

Fri, 26 January 2018 11:37

Ken Burton

Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana

Karma: 10

Senior Member

Get a small cigarette lighter recharge container of Butane. Those torches are in the discount chinese tools bins and usually near the front door. The come 2 to a package and are in a bubble pack about 6"x8"

Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328628 is a reply to message #328625]

Fri, 26 January 2018 11:42

Matt Colie

Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan

Karma: 7

Senior Member

Tom,

Another try to keep the line wrench from spreading, is a pair of Vise Grips on the outside of the line wrench. This will still be tough to fit in the available room around the top two lines that go to the master cylinder. I wish you luck, mine were not all that tough to get loose.

Matt

Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit

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Re: [GMCnet] Transmission fluid in penetrate mixture [message #328629 is a reply to message #328627]

Fri, 26 January 2018 11:43

Ken Burton

Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana

Karma: 10

Senior Member

Walmart has had some of these in only one of the check out lines for months now. It might also do the job. These were around $5.00 I believe the brand was Jet Flame.

https://www.harborfreight.com/butane-micro-torch-63170.html

Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana

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