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Hydroboost, master cylinders, and pressure [message #318076] Sat, 27 May 2017 18:05 Go to next message
wally is currently offline  wally   United States
Messages: 643
Registered: August 2004
Location: Omaha Nebraska
Karma: 5
Senior Member
I've made a spreadsheet on Google sheets to show brake pressures available from hydroboost conversions of factory vacuum assist brakes specific to our GMC's. It shows pedal force, effects of different master cylinders and variable pump pressure.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2yNDR77iZDuC_mNj9syVgZTOP1HXGSpbT4vrS5xIw/edit?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2yNDR77iZDuC_mNj9syVgZTOP1HXGSpbT4vrS5xIw/edit?usp=sharing


Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook
Re: [GMCnet] Hydroboost, master cylinders, and pressure [message #318079 is a reply to message #318076] Sat, 27 May 2017 19:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ken Henderson is currently offline  Ken Henderson   United States
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
Senior Member
Wally,

I've been through your spreadsheet and I understand where all the numbers
come from, having deciphered all your divisors. However, I don't
understand the logic of the last two columns, I and J. The best I can
figure, you're saying that there are 4 different input rods available
(0.545" to 0.781" in diameter). And that the pedal pressure required to
produce output is dependent upon the area of the selected input rod (and
the mechanical advantage in the pedal)? Huh! Shows how much I know about
Hydroboost! I had always figured that the pedal pressure merely overcame a
spring load, independent of the PS pump pressure. Have I been that wrong
all this time?

I guess the reason for my confusion is my past experience with a Chevy P-30
chassis motorhome which had what I thought were a variant on Hydroboost
brakes. That coach had a really weird feeling brake pedal and the owner's
manual recognized that. It had a statement to the effect that "...it's OK
if the pedal goes all the way to the floor, you're still getting maximum
braking...". And I had a panic incident that verified that statement with
extremely good braking. Admittedly my current Hydroboost feels nothing
like that one did.

Ken
​ Confused​
H.


On Sat, May 27, 2017 at 7:05 PM, Wally Anderson
wrote:

> I've made a spreadsheet on Google sheets to show brake pressures available
> from hydroboost conversions of factory vacuum assist brakes specific to our
> GMC's. It shows pedal force, effects of different master cylinders and
> variable pump pressure.
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2yNDR77iZDuC_
> mNj9syVgZTOP1HXGSpbT4vrS5xIw/edit?usp=sharing
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2yNDR77iZDuC_
> mNj9syVgZTOP1HXGSpbT4vrS5xIw/edit?usp=sharing
> --
> Wally Anderson
> Omaha NE
> 75 Glenbrook
> Megasquirt III injection
> Bob Stone hydroBOOOOST
> Manny reaction arm system
> Branscombe Kelsey Hayes park brake
> http://wallyandsue.blogspot.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
Re: [GMCnet] Hydroboost, master cylinders, and pressure [message #318082 is a reply to message #318079] Sat, 27 May 2017 20:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
wally is currently offline  wally   United States
Messages: 643
Registered: August 2004
Location: Omaha Nebraska
Karma: 5
Senior Member
Ken Henderson wrote on Sat, 27 May 2017 19:46
Wally,

I've been through your spreadsheet and I understand where all the numbers
come from, having deciphered all your divisors. However, I don't
understand the logic of the last two columns, I and J. The best I can
figure, you're saying that there are 4 different input rods available
(0.545" to 0.781" in diameter). And that the pedal pressure required to
produce output is dependent upon the area of the selected input rod (and
the mechanical advantage in the pedal)? Huh! Shows how much I know about
Hydroboost! I had always figured that the pedal pressure merely overcame a
spring load, independent of the PS pump pressure. Have I been that wrong
all this time?

I guess the reason for my confusion is my past experience with a Chevy P-30
chassis motorhome which had what I thought were a variant on Hydroboost
brakes. That coach had a really weird feeling brake pedal and the owner's
manual recognized that. It had a statement to the effect that "...it's OK
if the pedal goes all the way to the floor, you're still getting maximum
braking...". And I had a panic incident that verified that statement with
extremely good braking. Admittedly my current Hydroboost feels nothing
like that one did.

Ken
​ Confused​
H.


On Sat, May 27, 2017 at 7:05 PM, Wally Anderson
wrote:

> I've made a spreadsheet on Google sheets to show brake pressures available
> from hydroboost conversions of factory vacuum assist brakes specific to our
> GMC's. It shows pedal force, effects of different master cylinders and
> variable pump pressure.
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2yNDR77iZDuC_
> mNj9syVgZTOP1HXGSpbT4vrS5xIw/edit?usp=sharing
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2yNDR77iZDuC_
> mNj9syVgZTOP1HXGSpbT4vrS5xIw/edit?usp=sharing
> --
> Wally Anderson
> Omaha NE
> 75 Glenbrook
> Megasquirt III injection
> Bob Stone hydroBOOOOST
> Manny reaction arm system
> Branscombe Kelsey Hayes park brake
> http://wallyandsue.blogspot.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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Ken, You got it. The whole hydroboost case is pressurized in operation so it pushes back on the input rod.


Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook
Re: [GMCnet] Hydroboost, master cylinders, and pressure [message #318086 is a reply to message #318082] Sat, 27 May 2017 22:12 Go to previous message
Ken Henderson is currently offline  Ken Henderson   United States
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
Senior Member
Thanks, Wally.

Some years ago I tore one down but either I didn't understand what I was
seeing or have slept too many times since then. I've still got it, so
maybe I'll have another look.

Kim Weeks is looking for articles for the next GMCMI newsletter. Why don't
you do a writeup on Hydroboost? Get me off the hook. Or maybe I can
review & edit for you.

Ken

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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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