Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » More new engine follies
| More new engine follies [message #344042] |
Sat, 08 June 2019 12:11  |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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What's that you say, Bunky? You bolted all that stuff yup to the front of the engine and forgot the 11/32 spacer under the alternator front mount? And now the alternator ain't aligned with the pulleys elsewhere?
Well, don't despair! Even if the spacer got misplaced. You COULD take the silly steering pump brackets loose again and spend a day getting everything correct because the pump won't let that bolt come out.
Or, you could make a stack of washers the correct thickness, attack them with your trusty Freight, Harbor nine dollar cut-off tool, slot them, loosen the silly bolt, slip 'em under, and tighten away.
Dunahugh would be horrified 
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #344049 is a reply to message #344042] |
Sat, 08 June 2019 15:18  |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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And after trial and error I note that the brackets shown in the parts manual are not the brackets used on my engine to mount the alternator. The book references a couple which aren't shown, I suspect I have one of those. So, back to Daves to see what I've misplaced.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #344051 is a reply to message #344042] |
Sat, 08 June 2019 16:15 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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On further inspection, there's an arm which goes from a stud on the valve cover bolt to the long bolt through the alternator upper bolt on which it swivels to tighten the belt along with the two bolts in slots on the lower mount. It's in the pictures I took of Dave Shattuck's engine. I remember it was there at disassembly. It doesn't show in the parts manual, it's one of the sets of unpictured parts. By actual test, the alternator will not align correctly without it. It's raining cats and dogs, when it lets up I will see if it's yet in the box o stuff that came back from Mr Beaver's shop along with the other stuff we took off the old engine. If it isn't, I'll find out if it's still o0n the old engine. If it isn't, I'll beg a model from Dave and make a duplicate out of a piece of steel strap or angle, whichever will fit.
Anyone interest6ed in the possible f-ups replacing the engine need only contact me, so far I've committed ALL of them. My old Datsun wagon was waaay easier.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #344157 is a reply to message #344042] |
Wed, 12 June 2019 09:57 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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I got it mounted and in line. Never underestimate the power of a 24" Crescent <TM> wrench as a bracket straightening tool. The missing bracket is, I'm told, missing or left off on many coaches. It's a brace, not an alignment item.
Excelsior!
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #344217 is a reply to message #344042] |
Sat, 15 June 2019 17:40 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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In with the radiator, courtesy of my floor jack, two jackstands, 2 4x4 pieces of cribbing lumber and about 30 cursewords. The bolt store os closed today, no 1/2" 3/8th bolts at Tractor Supply. Plenty of 3/4", flats, and locks. Full nut and nothing hanging out. Tomorrow is plumb and wire, new filters, fab a blank off plate for the fuel pump hole, fire it and leak test it.
Another GMCer needs a place to bunk at the rally next week. I told him it won't look nice inside but I have a bunk n a bag (sleeping) for him. If it explodes on the way, the Motel Sleaze will get the nod. Ain't missing this rally.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] More new engine follies [message #344220 is a reply to message #344217] |
Sat, 15 June 2019 18:08 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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HE says he'll bring his sleeping bag. I'm betting he'll get to use it.
We're going up on Wednesday, the 19th. You?
Ken H
On Sat, Jun 15, 2019 at 6:41 PM Johnny Bridges via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> In with the radiator, courtesy of my floor jack, two jackstands, 2 4x4
> pieces of cribbing lumber and about 30 cursewords. The bolt store os closed
> today, no 1/2" 3/8th bolts at Tractor Supply. Plenty of 3/4", flats, and
> locks. Full nut and nothing hanging out. Tomorrow is plumb and wire, new
> filters, fab a blank off plate for the fuel pump hole, fire it and leak
> test it.
> Another GMCer needs a place to bunk at the rally next week. I told him it
> won't look nice inside but I have a bunk n a bag (sleeping) for him. If it
> explodes on the way, the Motel Sleaze will get the nod. Ain't missing
> this rally.
>
> --johnny
> --
> Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
> Braselton, Ga.
> I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me
> in hell
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #344254 is a reply to message #344042] |
Sun, 16 June 2019 17:52 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Wed I believe. When I made the reservation they asked would it be OK if they put me by some guy named Henderson. K. I said that would be fine as long as there were no loud parties or people drinking strong spirits and playing loud hug - dancin' music.
Meantime, I didn't spin it. I could have, ever thing is plumbed and clamped and tested tight. Except the upper radiator hose. I finished the dipstick and the other hose. Wringing wet qwith sweat, greasy and pistoff. Not the time or frame of mind to pay needed attention to a PIA connection which absolutely has to be done right even if you can't see it. (You can't) I have had it blow off on the roar. Once was sufficient.
A shower later, she and I shall repair to the backyard and take air. In the morning, fill it and run it.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] More new engine follies [message #344268 is a reply to message #344254] |
Sun, 16 June 2019 20:19 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Good luck -- 'though I don't think you'll need that.
Ken
On Sun, Jun 16, 2019 at 6:53 PM Johnny Bridges via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> Wed I believe. When I made the reservation they asked would it be OK if
> they put me by some guy named Henderson. K. I said that would be fine as
> long as there were no loud parties or people drinking strong spirits and
> playing loud hug - dancin' music.
>
> Meantime, I didn't spin it. I could have, ever thing is plumbed and
> clamped and tested tight. Except the upper radiator hose. I finished the
> dipstick and the other hose. Wringing wet qwith sweat, greasy and
> pistoff. Not the time or frame of mind to pay needed attention to a PIA
> connection
> which absolutely has to be done right even if you can't see it. (You
> can't) I have had it blow off on the roar. Once was sufficient.
>
> A shower later, she and I shall repair to the backyard and take air. In
> the morning, fill it and run it.
>
> --johnny
> --
> Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
> Braselton, Ga.
> I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me
> in hell
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] More new engine follies [message #344270 is a reply to message #344268] |
Sun, 16 June 2019 21:49 |
dsmithy
Messages: 210
Registered: July 2012
Location: Lincoln Nebraska
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Gentlemen,
If I ever get the chance to take air and savor an adult beverage with the two of you I will be grateful for the opportunity.
Safe journeys.
Douglas & Virginia Smith
dsmithy18 at gmail
Lincoln Nebraska
’73 “Canyonlands” since ‘95: “Wanabizo”, Anishinabe Indian for “He gets lost driving” Yes, really.
Quadrabag/6 wheel disks/3;70 final/Paterson QuadraJet/Thorley’s/Sundry other
P&W PT6, no wait, that's the wish list...
> On Jun 16, 2019, at 8:19 PM, Ken Henderson via Gmclist wrote:
>
> Good luck -- 'though I don't think you'll need that.
>
> Ken
>
> On Sun, Jun 16, 2019 at 6:53 PM Johnny Bridges via Gmclist gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
>
>> Wed I believe. When I made the reservation they asked would it be OK if
>> they put me by some guy named Henderson. K. I said that would be fine as
>> long as there were no loud parties or people drinking strong spirits and
>> playing loud hug - dancin' music.
>>
>> Meantime, I didn't spin it. I could have, ever thing is plumbed and
>> clamped and tested tight. Except the upper radiator hose. I finished the
>> dipstick and the other hose. Wringing wet qwith sweat, greasy and
>> pistoff. Not the time or frame of mind to pay needed attention to a PIA
>> connection
>> which absolutely has to be done right even if you can't see it. (You
>> can't) I have had it blow off on the roar. Once was sufficient.
>>
>> A shower later, she and I shall repair to the backyard and take air. In
>> the morning, fill it and run it.
>>
>> --johnny
>> --
>> Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
>> Braselton, Ga.
>> I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me
>> in hell
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
> _______________________________________________
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Douglas & Virginia Smith,
dsmithy18 at gmail,
Lincoln Nebraska,
’73 “Sequoia” since ‘95: "Wanabizo";
Quadrabag/6 wheel disks/3:70 final/Paterson QuadraJet/Thorley’s/Alloy wheels/Sundry other
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #344302 is a reply to message #344042] |
Mon, 17 June 2019 17:32 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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I have it in one piece. Pulled the sparking plugs out, spun it on the starter till the oil pressure came up to 40 psi (on the starter) and figured it's properly oiled. Six quarts of Driven 10 - 40 conventional break - in oil, per the rebuilder's instructions. Got a case of the stuff for after break - in too. Each quart looks like 28 ounces of ZDDP and 4 of oil
If I did my arithmetic right, give the number of bolts and accessories - and the blank plate, don't forget the blank plate - there are about 2,734 possibilities here of which fewer than ten are correct. I don't think I missed any of the wrong ones.
It needs the Atomic FI brain remounted and the harnesses ty - rapped <tm> up. But I wanted to hear it vroom before I called it a day. 12 volts on the FlameThrower, a bit of gas down the FI throat and spin it. The sumbich VROOMs. No gross leaks that I can see. I'll put a hundred miles on it tomorrow afternoon and check everything. Wednesday we roll.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] More new engine follies [message #344305 is a reply to message #344302] |
Mon, 17 June 2019 18:00 |
Randy Hecht
Messages: 93
Registered: March 2019
Location: Roswell, GA
Karma: -5
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Slight movement
Chaplain Randy Hecht
Chaplains are ready to Listen when you're ready to talk.
> On Jun 17, 2019, at 6:32 PM, Johnny Bridges via Gmclist wrote:
>
> I have it in one piece. Pulled the sparking plugs out, spun it on the starter till the oil pressure came up to 40 psi (on the starter) and figured
> it's properly oiled. Six quarts of Driven 10 - 40 conventional break - in oil, per the rebuilder's instructions. Got a case of the stuff for after
> break - in too. Each quart looks like 28 ounces of ZDDP and 4 of oil :)
> If I did my arithmetic right, give the number of bolts and accessories - and the blank plate, don't forget the blank plate - there are about 2,734
> possibilities here of which fewer than ten are correct. I don't think I missed any of the wrong ones.
> It needs the Atomic FI brain remounted and the harnesses ty - rapped up. But I wanted to hear it vroom before I called it a day. 12 volts on
> the FlameThrower, a bit of gas down the FI throat and spin it. The sumbich VROOMs. No gross leaks that I can see. I'll put a hundred miles on it
> tomorrow afternoon and check everything. Wednesday we roll.
>
> --johnny
> --
> Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
> Braselton, Ga.
> I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #345277 is a reply to message #344042] |
Sun, 14 July 2019 14:02 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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So I started out, it overheated, I came home. Finally got back to figuring it out. I though perhaps there's too much space around the fan shroud. Actually, in retrospect, it overheated by sitting idling in traffic for about fifteen minutes at 750 - 800 RPM or so, I shut it down at 220 degrees, let it cool a bit, and brought it home for further inspection. Again in retrospect, it was like 110 F on the asphalt. So, today I fired it up and high idled it in neutral. About 210 - 215 on the gauge, the fan came on. Again at high idle, pulled it right down to ~~ 185 and shut off. Warmed back up and came on again and pulled it down. My override switch has no effect, I'll chase the wiring and find out why. In the interim, we'll stay out of Drive stopped in traffic on hot days. Air/Fuel ratio gauge says 14.7 - 15.0 at high idle, no leaks, and the like. Mr. John didn't seem greatly bothered by the oil pressure, which is running 60 - 80 PSI depending RPM. It has failed the mechanical gauge though, which now has oil about a third of the way up the glass. This on 10-40 breakin oil full of ZDDP. Tomorrow I'll run it up the freeway a ways and back through the back roads and see how it does. If it's as smooth as it has been, it's ready to go. Next scheduled trip is to Harrison Bay State Park North of Chattanooga for a four day show. If the filter is clean when I open it after the breakin oil change, I'm gonna 'drive it like you stole it'.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #345308 is a reply to message #344042] |
Sun, 14 July 2019 18:33 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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a: 2 gallons of glycol (Whichever one comes in the yellow bottle) and filled with distilled water since I had four or five gallons of it kicking around.
b: Better not be a problem with the fan clutch, it's the electric one a couple of our suppliers sell with a gee - whiz controller. Off a Mercedes Sprinter.
I'll point out in re the fan and clutch assembly, I don't use any of the several controllers, the first few of which I built. The MSD Atomic FI has two fan outputs for electric fans each settable for turn on temperature. I think I set it for 210 or so on one, 198 or so on the other, and paralleled them running the clutch relay. The current kit now supplies an adjustable temp controller, much less fuss than the initial which controlled the turn on temp by the selection of the probe in the water jacket. As well as being settable with a control, I suspect it's more accurate than the temp probes which all appear to be made by the heathen chinee these days.
There are in the background some trials going on with a PWM controller which would vary the speed of the fan infinitely rather than it's on or off. The intent is to perhaps quiet the operation a bit. I've not been involved in this, frankly I want to hear the thing spin up. The manufacturer tells us it's not hurt by having the clutch valve engaged fully all the time. I look on the setup I have as being PWM with very wide pulses. Also, my coach has considerable sound deadening and the Mercedes fan doesn't make nearly as much racket as the original when it's spinning. Control it however you see fit is my approach.
Those of you who saw Tom Pryor's demo unit at a rally may have noticed the tachometer. The Mercedes clutch, like all the electric ones I've seen, has the ability to drive a tach. Feed it 5 volts and ground and it will spit out a pulse train of 6 pulses per revolution. If you wan accuracy, divide the pulse train by 2 with a simple flip-flop chip and feed the result into a tach set for a six cylinder engine and you will get true RPM of the fan.
As an aside, if you want a tach that's useful on the GMC as opposed to one which never rises above about half scale, set the tach for a four cylinder engine. Then remove the lens carefully, black out the numbers, and replace them with drafting rub - offs with each being half the number it covers. This will give you on an 8K tach 0 to 4K full scale. Too me, a lot more useful. Plus, people who saw it (SunTach II) were all like "Where'd you get a 4k Tach? Cost a fortune?" I think it was 29.95 and mounted above and between the two OEM clusters. Unless Mike Briere has redone the dash, it should still be on his coach.
--johnny
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #345310 is a reply to message #345308] |
Sun, 14 July 2019 18:50 |
6cuda6
Messages: 975
Registered: June 2019
Karma: -6
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Senior Member |
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It might be a side step but measure the coolant thats in your coach....if you dont have an antifreeze tester (the basic bobble with a suction bulb type is good enough) you might have to spurge at Autozone for one.....you need a 50/50 mix...if its to far off one way or the other it will affect the heat carrying capability of the coolant.
If this was an old motor you might get away with a bad blend but with a new tight motor thats going to run hot to start with its gotta be right.
Rich Mondor,
Brockville, ON
77 Hughes 2600
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| Re: [GMCnet] More new engine follies [message #345315 is a reply to message #345310] |
Sun, 14 July 2019 19:19 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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If the fan does not come on around 210, then you need to adjust the
controller.
I have put on over 25,000 miles on the same unit and have swapped 3
controllers.
Controllers come from Red China.
On Sun, Jul 14, 2019 at 4:51 PM tonka6cuda6--- via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> It might be a side step but measure the coolant thats in your coach....if
> you dont have an antifreeze tester (the basic bobble with a suction bulb
> type is good enough) you might have to spurge at Autozone for one.....you
> need a 50/50 mix...if its to far off one way or the other it will affect the
> heat carrying capability of the coolant.
>
> If this was an old motor you might get away with a bad blend but with a
> new tight motor thats going to run hot to start with its gotta be right.
> --
> Rich Mondor,
>
> Brockville, ON
>
> 77 Hughes 2600
>
> _______________________________________________
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--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #345330 is a reply to message #344042] |
Mon, 15 July 2019 07:24 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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a: The fan comes on at the desired setting.
b: The controller is an MSD Atomic fuel injection system. Made in this country and working correctly.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: More new engine follies [message #345331 is a reply to message #345330] |
Mon, 15 July 2019 07:40 |
6cuda6
Messages: 975
Registered: June 2019
Karma: -6
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Johnny Bridges wrote on Mon, 15 July 2019 08:24a: The fan comes on at the desired setting.
b: The controller is an MSD Atomic fuel injection system. Made in this country and working correctly.
--johnny
Johnny check your coolant blend.....rule out the basics and the easiest first.....it needs to be 50/50 +/- 5 or its not going to cool properly.
Rich Mondor,
Brockville, ON
77 Hughes 2600
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