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Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch [message #247395 is a reply to message #247393]

Mon, 14 April 2014 13:22

James Hupy

Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010

Karma:

Senior Member

An idea that has popped into my head from time to time is an identical
blade configuration to what we now have with a full coverage shroud with
diffusers between the grill and radiator, much like the 77-78 coaches have.
The differences being that the fan hub, instead of a viscous clutch, has a
thermostatically modulated feathering mechanism similar to an aircraft
propeller. One of the GMC CASCADERS builds a feathering hub for a turboprop
engine that he builds for homebuilt aircraft utilizing an APU from a
Chinook twin rotor helicopter. It looks robust enough to me for feathering
a coolant fan. What do you all think? Please don't slay the messenger, I am
just in the idea phase of this deal.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Apr 14, 2014 11:07 AM, "Les Burt" <lburt@videotron.ca> wrote:

>
>
> Patrick,
> A very interesting example that brings a few thoughts to mind.
>
> Moving air with a fan takes horsepower, the higher the air flow being
> moved, the higher the HP consumed. I don't have exact facts to quote, but I
> do believe that the OEM fans on our coaches consume several HP because of
> the air they need to move. Trying to produce the equivalent airflow with
> electric fans is going to require a fairly hefty electrical output
> (possibly 150-200a?) to supply 1 or 2 powerful fan motors, or several
> smaller units. This is what I believe is the limiting factor in converting
> our coaches.
>
> The Buses with electric fans are probably not using them because they cool
> better, but because they are an easier system to implement and maintain.
> Running electrical wires and coolant hoses through tight quarters and
> around corners presents fewer difficulties than routing mechanical power in
> the same environment. Hydraulic fans are similar to Electric in that
> respect.
>
>
>
>
> fitzmorrispr wrote on Sat, 12 April 2014 23:59
> > There is one question I can answer in here. "Can an all electric fan
> setup
> > cool our rigs properly?"
> >
> > Yes.
> >
> > Evidence?
> >
> > The local transit agency, LA County's Metro, uses all electric cooling on
> > their 45 foot NABI CompoBuses. These units are running large inline 6
> > turbocharged CNG engines. And by large I do mean large. Upwards of 8
> > liters, as I recall.
> >
> > Being rear engined, with a longitudinally mounted engine, the radiator is
> > alongside the block, much like it would be in a small transverse mounted
> > fwd car, but with lots more room. Electric is not even close to the only
> > option. Many of the older buses in their fleet, such as older New Flyers
> > and NABIs use other setups. One example runs a very long belt across the
> > back of the compartment to a pulley on a long shaft, which runs into a
> > gearbox on the back of the fan. Another runs the fan off the (gear
> driven)
> > power steering pump. This hydraulic fan was powerful enough to pull you
> off
> > balance if you happened to be next to the radiator. On similarly built
> > diesel school buses, I have seen setups where the radiator is mounted
> > diagonally in a box, so the fan can be directly belt driven, while the
> air
> > is pulled from alongside the engine.
> >
> > The cooling needs of the compobus are much the same as these other
> variants
> > I've mentioned, but the compobus uses electric fans, and has no cooling
> > issues. It uses an array of nine small fans mounted directly to the
> > radiator. They look like computer fans.
> >
> > Just my loose change.
> > -Patrick
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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>
>
> --
> Les Burt
> Montreal
> 1975 Eleganza 26ft
> A work in Progress
>
> _______________________________________________
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		Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: George Beckman on Tue, 08 April 2014 11:30
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Luvn737s on Tue, 08 April 2014 15:44
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: tphipps on Tue, 08 April 2014 15:51
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Tue, 08 April 2014 16:32
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Wed, 09 April 2014 02:46
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bruce Hart on Tue, 08 April 2014 18:23
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Tue, 08 April 2014 19:12
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Jim Bounds on Wed, 09 April 2014 11:03
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: JohnL455 on Tue, 08 April 2014 20:56
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: A Hamilto on Tue, 08 April 2014 22:51
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: JohnL455 on Wed, 09 April 2014 19:27
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: sgltrac on Wed, 09 April 2014 19:46
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Wed, 09 April 2014 19:59
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Ken Henderson on Wed, 09 April 2014 20:29
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bruce Hart on Wed, 09 April 2014 20:36
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Wed, 09 April 2014 21:03
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: roy1 on Wed, 09 April 2014 20:42
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Wed, 09 April 2014 21:05
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Dave Mumert on Wed, 09 April 2014 21:35
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: noi on Wed, 09 April 2014 23:59
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Thu, 10 April 2014 09:50
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: A Hamilto on Thu, 10 April 2014 10:41
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Thu, 10 April 2014 13:53
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: James Hupy on Thu, 10 April 2014 18:41
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:06
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:50
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Fri, 11 April 2014 07:28
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Fri, 11 April 2014 09:18
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Fri, 11 April 2014 17:47
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Fri, 11 April 2014 10:45
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Fri, 11 April 2014 18:06
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Fri, 11 April 2014 18:27
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Fri, 11 April 2014 23:09
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Fri, 11 April 2014 23:20
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Sat, 12 April 2014 15:43
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Fri, 11 April 2014 09:30
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: jhbridges on Thu, 10 April 2014 13:49
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Thu, 10 April 2014 14:30
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: WD0AFQ on Thu, 10 April 2014 15:29
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Sammy Williams on Thu, 10 April 2014 16:08
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: habbyguy on Thu, 10 April 2014 16:26
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Thu, 10 April 2014 17:59
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: emerystora on Thu, 10 April 2014 17:59
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:13
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: A Hamilto on Fri, 11 April 2014 15:13
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: jhbridges on Thu, 10 April 2014 18:50
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Thu, 10 April 2014 18:04
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: jhbridges on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:09
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: jim kanomata on Wed, 16 April 2014 00:49
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: ljdavick on Wed, 16 April 2014 01:15
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Wed, 16 April 2014 13:40
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: ljdavick on Wed, 16 April 2014 13:46
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: k2gkk on Wed, 09 April 2014 20:00
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: ljdavick on Wed, 09 April 2014 20:04
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: JohnL455 on Wed, 09 April 2014 21:24
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Wed, 09 April 2014 21:47
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: WD0AFQ on Thu, 10 April 2014 18:38
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:26
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: stick miller on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:33
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Thu, 10 April 2014 19:56
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Fri, 11 April 2014 07:32
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Fri, 11 April 2014 09:08
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Al The HeatGuy on Fri, 11 April 2014 13:23
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Fri, 11 April 2014 15:15
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Ken Burton on Fri, 11 April 2014 17:24
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: kelvin on Fri, 11 April 2014 17:28
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Al The HeatGuy on Fri, 11 April 2014 18:04
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Matt Colie on Sat, 12 April 2014 20:38
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Al The HeatGuy on Fri, 11 April 2014 17:52
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: mikethebike on Fri, 11 April 2014 17:59
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC_LES on Fri, 11 April 2014 18:56
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Fri, 11 April 2014 18:25
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC_LES on Fri, 11 April 2014 19:23
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Dennis S on Fri, 11 April 2014 14:40
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Rick Williams on Fri, 11 April 2014 19:03
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Kingsley Coach on Fri, 11 April 2014 19:51
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Fri, 11 April 2014 19:55
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Sammy Williams on Fri, 11 April 2014 19:56
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Fri, 11 April 2014 20:35
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Sammy Williams on Fri, 11 April 2014 21:10
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: powerjon on Fri, 11 April 2014 23:03
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Sat, 12 April 2014 07:20
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: noi on Fri, 11 April 2014 21:03
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: noi on Fri, 11 April 2014 22:12
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: roy1 on Fri, 11 April 2014 22:36
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: WD0AFQ on Sat, 12 April 2014 08:37
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Sat, 12 April 2014 14:06
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: WD0AFQ on Sat, 12 April 2014 15:13
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: k2gkk on Sat, 12 April 2014 15:37
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: habbyguy on Sat, 12 April 2014 19:54
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: burtco99 on Sat, 12 April 2014 11:50
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: winter on Sat, 12 April 2014 20:18
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: habbyguy on Sat, 12 April 2014 20:32
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Don A on Sat, 12 April 2014 20:52
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: fitzmorrispr on Sat, 12 April 2014 22:59
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: burtco99 on Mon, 14 April 2014 13:06
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: A Hamilto on Mon, 14 April 2014 13:15
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: roy1 on Mon, 14 April 2014 14:31
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Mon, 14 April 2014 15:05
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Mon, 14 April 2014 15:27
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Mon, 14 April 2014 17:54
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: GMC.LES on Mon, 14 April 2014 18:29
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: shawnee on Mon, 14 April 2014 21:38
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: James Hupy on Mon, 14 April 2014 13:22
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Mon, 14 April 2014 20:08
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: burtco99 on Mon, 14 April 2014 21:52
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: kerry pinkerton on Mon, 14 April 2014 18:30
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: James Hupy on Mon, 14 April 2014 18:38
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: KB on Mon, 14 April 2014 19:52
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Mon, 14 April 2014 20:09
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: sgltrac on Tue, 15 April 2014 17:14
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Bob de Kruyff on Tue, 15 April 2014 17:30
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: Ken Henderson on Tue, 15 April 2014 18:38
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: USAussie on Wed, 16 April 2014 00:05
		Re: [GMCnet] Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: sgltrac on Sun, 20 April 2014 16:39
		Re: Oh, Sure, Another Fan Clutch By: JohnL455 on Mon, 14 April 2014 21:45

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